Beer Garden

Anything goes here.. :) Now with Beer Garden for our smoking patrons.
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Nort
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Re: Beer Garden

#2911 Post by Nort » Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:15 pm

I feel for the business because having people avoiding the area due to roadworks would make things difficult. That said some parts of it don't follow such as them saying that they were using the other stores to support the original one, but then if the other stores closed first it would suggest they weren't profitable either.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2912 Post by Brucetiki » Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:44 pm

Another woe is me story about Red Door.

https://citymag.indaily.com.au/culture/ ... -adelaide/

The excuses are now that there were no signs or no marketing from the T2T Alliance for businesses. Ummm there have been many clear signs promoting and directing traffic to local businesses throughout the T2T project.

They just don't seem to want to take responsibility for their own demise.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2913 Post by Nathan » Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:46 pm

The road works around the area have been extensive, and have hurt all the businesses along Queen/Elizabeth St. This is not a problem unique to RDB, and they're not the first to have shut up shop or to move away. After the signalised intersection was finished on Port Rd, access over the level crossing was closed for a considerable amount of time. Meanwhile access from South Rd is now a bit of a labyrinth (for instance, for us coming from Hawker St — from the Hawker St/South Rd intersection we need to make seven turns to get there), and many of the roads have been going through complete resurfacing over the last two years resulting in random closures and roads sitting unsurfaced for months. They're not overstating it in the slightest.

The city store closed at the start of last year due to high rents, but Croydon Social (which was two doors down from the Croydon RDB) and the KWS store were both still running.
Last edited by Nathan on Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2914 Post by Nathan » Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:48 pm

Brucetiki wrote:
Thu Sep 20, 2018 2:44 pm
The excuses are now that there were no signs or no marketing from the T2T Alliance for businesses. Ummm there have been many clear signs promoting and directing traffic to local businesses throughout the T2T project.
Not really. All the marketing efforts have been from the traders themselves, and the council.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2915 Post by rev » Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:48 pm

LOL what marketing efforts by Red Door and their pizza business on the side? I live in the area, and haven't seen a single thing.

Poor business model exposed by a curve ball, operators failed to adapt, and they're gone.

They could have spoken with someone from T2T and worked out a deal to provide food for the construction workers of T2T and the rail upgrade works, especially at night. That would have negated some of the impact of road works.

But I guess it's easier to blame someone else. :toilet:

Where's the labyrinth..?
From Hawker Street..left at South Road right at Port Road and right at Queen/Elizabeth st. Simple.
On the other side, Left at Ellen street from Torrens road, left at Henry street, and right at Elizabeth.

Quite simple and if you're a local you don't need a map to work those two routes out.

My 79 year old father can figure his way out around road works and heavy traffic still, not to mention he's had no trouble in Melbourne on the freeways and which exits and on ramps to take...but apparently people in Adelaide struggle with a little disruption in their lives. Woe is me indeed :lol:

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Re: Beer Garden

#2916 Post by Waewick » Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:10 pm

To be fair, i know of a few businesses that lost 75 - 80% of their turnover once t2 started.

I know its easy to blame poor management, but these big infrastructure works can impact local businesses. And from all reports, not enough effort was made to assist businesses during this period.

I don't think anyone is against the upgrades, but some thought needs to be given to impacted businesses.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2917 Post by SBD » Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:24 pm

Brucetiki wrote:
Thu Sep 20, 2018 1:31 pm
Sounds more like incompetent management rather than T2T works - if anything the T2T works made access to the Queen St store easier with the Queen St/Port Rd intersection now signalised.
I couldn't work out from the story whether the intended market is Croydon locals, passing trade from other areas, or being a "destination" that people will travel deliberately to these venues.
  • It's hard to believe that the Croydon locals couldn't find their ways to it past the roadworks, since they needed to get home/go out anyway.
  • If it was a great place to pass with a (congested but) roadwork-free South Road nearby, how could it possibly be less attractive to just pass when there are roadworks blocking the main route
  • If it's that great a destination, people will find it - like a Mexican restaurant in the back streets of Salisbury that got in the news recently
I also don't understand why if you have three shops and one is struggling because of roadworks and needs to be supported by the other two, you would close one of the others, not the one that is struggling.

I also realised that I had never heard of shops on Queen Street Croydon until the T2T works and public information about how to get to it. I still haven't been there, so the marketing didn't completely work, but at least I've heard of it now.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2918 Post by SBD » Thu Sep 20, 2018 9:29 pm

Waewick wrote:
Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:10 pm
To be fair, i know of a few businesses that lost 75 - 80% of their turnover once t2 started.

I know its easy to blame poor management, but these big infrastructure works can impact local businesses. And from all reports, not enough effort was made to assist businesses during this period.

I don't think anyone is against the upgrades, but some thought needs to be given to impacted businesses.
If I had been a regular customer of business(es) that weren't on South Road before the road works started, I can't imagine that having road works on South Road would be the reason I would stop being a customer of those businesses. It would be interesting to know whether T2T roadworks have had an effect, and in which direction, on trade at Vili's on Main North Road - another family-owned bakery on a road parallel to the roadworks.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2919 Post by Llessur2002 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:52 am

As in a lot of cases I'm sure there are a number of reasons for this business going into liquidation and the T2T roadworks will have undoubtedly been a contributing factor.

I am very much a local to Queen Street (or Elizabeth Street to call it by its true name north of the railway line where the shops are) - it is a 3 minute walk from my house (hence my expanding waistline) and I head round with the family most weekends for something or other. Usually one of Red Door's amazing cakes. I can absolutely confirm that during the weeks/months when Queen Street was closed to traffic for both the Queen Street/Port Road intersection and the rebuilding of Croydon Station the street was pretty much dead and all of the businesses were suffering a very obvious loss in trade. The usually-thriving cafes in particular were virtually empty a lot of the time.

I presume the loss in trade was from from all areas. People do come from afar to visit the Queen Street business - we know people from the Hills and the eastern suburbs who have been visiting every few weeks for years and a lot of people arrive by car on the weekends, presumably including those from the immediate area such as Bowden, Brompton, Ridleyton etc. Then there are the 'very' locals such as my family, who usually walk. The closure of the roads - not just Queen Street but also Port Road and South Road will have made it challenging for those who did not pay good attention to the T2T traffic updates to access the area. Judge it wrong and you'd end up stuck in a tailback on Port Road for 20 minutes or find yourself on a long detour. I can see why this will have eventually put off those who live outside of the area - especially as non-locals will be presumably less likely to be aware of the closure timetable and alternative routes. The sporadic closure of South Road carriageways will also have made it challenging for those coming in from Bowden and Brompton - I can see why both of these groups may have looked for an alternative option elsewhere.

Then, for those who could still make it to Queen Street - the locals and the diehards - the atmosphere was very different to what it normally is. The street was heavily trafficked by noisy works vehicles - trucks, utes, low loaders, excavators etc and there was dust and dirt everywhere, especially in summer - presumably peak trade time. When the road was open there were a lot of people using it as a rat run to avoid the roadworks on Port Road and South Road. Not a very nice dining experience to be honest.

This disruption continued for over two years - by no means an insignificant amount of time. Then, just when the T2T works were dying down the Council decided to resurface the nearby Thomas Street, Day Terrace and Euston Terrace - meaning another 3-4 months of traffic disruption and works vehicles. This work needed to be done but the timing was unfortunate.

So whilst I have absolutely no doubt that the T2T works will have caused a significant loss in trade for all business on Queen Street, since the T2T works have slowed down Queen Street cafe and the new crêperie seem to have been trading very strongly - even through the winter months it has been difficult to get a table at either on the weekends. Red Door however has remained noticeably quieter than it has historically been. I do wonder whether the arrival of the very popular new crêperie has eaten into their business at an inconvenient time - both have some overlap in their product range (coffee, croissants and pastries) plus the crêperie has the advantage of being both new and spectacularly good (if you haven't already been I'd highly recommend it - the owner/chef is actually French which seems to help a lot - https://adelaidefoodcentral.com/2017/05 ... -creperie/).

Plus, and this is pure speculation, it is difficult to know how the failure of the Grenfell Street store impacted the rest of the business financially, or whatever other factors may have been involved.

Either way it is very sad to have lost an iconic and very much loved local business. The owners have lost pretty much everything - including their house which is a very sad situation indeed. Then there are the 30-odd staff who were all lovely. Hopefully they will be able to rebuild from here and continue doing what they love.
Last edited by Llessur2002 on Fri Sep 21, 2018 2:18 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2920 Post by PeFe » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:15 am

The ABC's Australian Story are doing a program on Whyalla/Sanjeev Gupta airing Monday September 24. Should be a good watch.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2921 Post by Norman » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:16 am

I believe the Torrens Junction works would also have impacted the business, as the rail line was shut down for months.

I also believe that there is a lot more competition out there now in terms of local bakeries. If you find a good one near your house, why would you travel by car or train to Croydon when you have an alternative near your place that is just as good or better.

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Re: Beer Garden

#2922 Post by rev » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:40 am

PeFe wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:15 am
The ABC's Australian Story are doing a program on Whyalla/Sanjeev Gupta airing Monday September 24. Should be a good watch.
I wonder if they'll have anything on Adani's involvement in the solar project here in SA, while over in Queensland they are destroying fresh water sources, or if it'll be another usual ABC piece :?:

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Re: Beer Garden

#2923 Post by PeFe » Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:34 pm

rev wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:40 am
PeFe wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:15 am
The ABC's Australian Story are doing a program on Whyalla/Sanjeev Gupta airing Monday September 24. Should be a good watch.
I wonder if they'll have anything on Adani's involvement in the solar project here in SA, while over in Queensland they are destroying fresh water sources, or if it'll be another usual ABC piece :?:
Adani and Sanjev Gupta's Liberty Group are 2 entirely unrelated companies......I hope you're logic is better than "they both have Indian names, I wonder if they are related or the same thing?"

Adani invests in coal mines and renewable energy. Yes even coal miners want to make money from renewables.....

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Re: Beer Garden

#2924 Post by Goodsy » Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:57 pm

PeFe wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:34 pm
rev wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:40 am
PeFe wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:15 am
The ABC's Australian Story are doing a program on Whyalla/Sanjeev Gupta airing Monday September 24. Should be a good watch.
I wonder if they'll have anything on Adani's involvement in the solar project here in SA, while over in Queensland they are destroying fresh water sources, or if it'll be another usual ABC piece :?:
Adani and Sanjev Gupta's Liberty Group are 2 entirely unrelated companies......I hope you're logic is better than "they both have Indian names, I wonder if they are related or the same thing?"

Adani invests in coal mines and renewable energy. Yes even coal miners want to make money from renewables.....
Gupta also has no business ties to India, he's a British businessman through and through

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Re: Beer Garden

#2925 Post by rev » Sat Sep 22, 2018 7:26 am

PeFe wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 3:34 pm
rev wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:40 am
PeFe wrote:
Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:15 am
The ABC's Australian Story are doing a program on Whyalla/Sanjeev Gupta airing Monday September 24. Should be a good watch.
I wonder if they'll have anything on Adani's involvement in the solar project here in SA, while over in Queensland they are destroying fresh water sources, or if it'll be another usual ABC piece :?:
Adani and Sanjev Gupta's Liberty Group are 2 entirely unrelated companies......I hope you're logic is better than "they both have Indian names, I wonder if they are related or the same thing?"

Adani invests in coal mines and renewable energy. Yes even coal miners want to make money from renewables.....
Wow...

Did I say anything about the ethnicity of those involved you imbecile? :roll:

I actually read on another site that the two companies were doing a solar project together, hence my post.

Go be butthurt in a corner and leave me alone.

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