2018 South Australian State Election

[rubberman]

Well every state Govt. would secretly like the fact that they have these population problems. It means their economy is travelling well. Jay on the other hand, conveniently, says he doesn't support high population growth..... only because we don't have it

The fact that that every other states unemployment rate is on par, or better than ours is that those extra people (a lot more than us) are being absorbed into the labour market. It's economics 101.

Let's make this clear. I don't want or expect Adelaide's population to hit 4 million in the next 30 years, but 2 million would be more than hoped based on our once significant place in this country. And we ain't gonna get there on our current path.

Actually, that might be the case but for one thing: Australia's vertical fiscal imbalance. That is, the Feds get all the extra tax money that immigrants provide, but the States have to fund the infrastructure. It's a serious problem.

Here's a link : http://www.ncoa.gov.au/report/appendix- ... lance.html

Also, it so happens that Queensland has slightly higher unemployment. However, what good is higher employment in these other states if the cost of housing wipes out that advantage?

It's a simple question that people knocking SA refuse to answer.

As far as I am concerned, those states with unaffordable housing are simply disqualified from comparison. Of course, if someone thinks living in a car or renting forever in Sydney is somehow something that demonstrates that NSW is ahead of SA somehow, they are entitled to their opinion. However, if people's aim in life is to rent forever, well, Sydney or Melbourne is for them. No harm, no foul.

I guess though for someone who wants to own their own home, enjoy work/life balance rather than spend their leisure time in a bus, SA is better than most other states. The penalty of maybe 0.5% more unemployment is a fair exchange.

You use lots of big words chief. But let's be honest, I can only compare us to WA. and I lived there for 10 years. I suggest you have a holiday and drive around our nearest competitor.

Oh, goody. Is this the point where I say the Liberals spent so much that WA now has the highest level of State Government debt per capita in the country? If I drive round, I will see lots of shiny new things?

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation ... 4c48d61445

If you bothered to read, I have backed up most of my assertions with links to the facts.

Now, I understand that this is an electioneering page, so you wouldn't be a Liberal supporter fresh from trashing WA's economy wanting to do the same here, would you?

Sorry, but how about instead of just throwing disparaging remarks about SA, you just come up with some facts?

I have been repeating this, but I shall re-repeat it. Other than bigger populations, which bring huge problems, what advantages are there in living in other States? Employment, housing costs, commuting times, State debt, school crowding? When everything is taken into account, where is this bloody nirvana SA is being compared to? At this point, I am beginning to suspect the critics have no facts.

[Nort]

There are some massive advantages that comes in terms of opportunities when you live in a major population centre. For example if you work in the games/simulation/interactive experience space it's almost a requirement to move to Melbourne because it attracts a disproportionate amount of companies. Part of that is due to the large population meaning there are more skilled workers there which means a business setting up knows they can more easily get the staff they want. Another big part is the government support for that space.

On the first factor we can't compete, on the second we can and the current state government has been making great strides in recent years in talking to those industries to figure out what can be done to make SA more appealing.

[rev]

Hi, the doomsday point of view was what the article you posted said. Are you saying you don't agree with the article you yourself posted?

As for relevance. I guess it's a question whether the price of relevance is worth it. The article YOU linked says that those cities are paying a heavy price for their "relevance".

Well every state Govt. would secretly like the fact that they have these population problems. It means their economy is travelling well. Jay on the other hand, conveniently, says he doesn't support high population growth..... only because we don't have it

The fact that that every other states unemployment rate is on par, or better than ours is that those extra people (a lot more than us) are being absorbed into the labour market. It's economics 101.

Let's make this clear. I don't want or expect Adelaide's population to hit 4 million in the next 30 years, but 2 million would be more than hoped based on our once significant place in this country. And we ain't gonna get there on our current path.

Actually, that might be the case but for one thing: Australia's vertical fiscal imbalance. That is, the Feds get all the extra tax money that immigrants provide, but the States have to fund the infrastructure. It's a serious problem.

Here's a link : http://www.ncoa.gov.au/report/appendix- ... lance.html

Also, it so happens that Queensland has slightly higher unemployment. However, what good is higher employment in these other states if the cost of housing wipes out that advantage?

It's a simple question that people knocking SA refuse to answer.

As far as I am concerned, those states with unaffordable housing are simply disqualified from comparison. Of course, if someone thinks living in a car or renting forever in Sydney is somehow something that demonstrates that NSW is ahead of SA somehow, they are entitled to their opinion. However, if people's aim in life is to rent forever, well, Sydney or Melbourne is for them. No harm, no foul.

I guess though for someone who wants to own their own home, enjoy work/life balance rather than spend their leisure time in a bus, SA is better than most other states. The penalty of maybe 0.5% more unemployment is a fair exchange.

But isn't this what most people on this forum are in favor of? Less detached housing and more apartments towers?
How do you think in most cities around the world that have a high percentage or clusters of apartment towers, work? Don't tell me people on this forum are that naive that they think that everyone owns their own apartment? The majority are paying rent.

While you dismiss any valid comparison between Australian cities(who are we supposed to compare with, if not other capital cities in our country?), you ignore the fact that the housing market has become unaffordable especially in Sydney because our government has allowed foreign vultures like the Chinese to invest their corrupt money in Australia.
Take away Chinese investments in Australian real estate, and the housing market would probably return to a state of normality quickly.

Did you know developers organize bus tours of their developments exclusively for Chinese communist investors who fly in? Thank god Adelaide hasn't really been affected to the scale Sydney has by this sort of dodgy shit yet, and hopefully wont be.

It's also nice of you to gloss over reality, using housing affordability(without actually looking at all the facts associated with it anyway), to try and paint some rosey picture of SA being up there with the economic power houses of this country.

I mean, really, why can't the rest of the world see how great this state is..is basically the core of your argument, followed by, the other states aren't better, in fact, SA is better because a house is still some what affordable in Adelaide(unless you wan to live anywhere within a 20 minute drive to the CBD, then you're shit out of luck).
The rest of the world is blind and stupid right? That's why there's no major foreign investments in SA without state government enticements or the federal government awarding a defence contract..or a foreign billionaire swooping in to buy up something at a bargain price that in the near future he will sell off for a profit anyway.

If only things were as simple, and as rosey, as some people make out.

I mean yeh, there's progress in Adelaide. Yay, let's throw a party, because only Adelaide is building infrastructure. Every other city is standing still.


You guys really need to take your SA IS THE GREATEST!!! sunnies, and look at things from a neutral point of view for a change.
We have an election tomorrow, now's a great time to try it.

[rev]

Actually, that might be the case but for one thing: Australia's vertical fiscal imbalance. That is, the Feds get all the extra tax money that immigrants provide, but the States have to fund the infrastructure. It's a serious problem.

Here's a link : http://www.ncoa.gov.au/report/appendix- ... lance.html

Also, it so happens that Queensland has slightly higher unemployment. However, what good is higher employment in these other states if the cost of housing wipes out that advantage?

It's a simple question that people knocking SA refuse to answer.

As far as I am concerned, those states with unaffordable housing are simply disqualified from comparison. Of course, if someone thinks living in a car or renting forever in Sydney is somehow something that demonstrates that NSW is ahead of SA somehow, they are entitled to their opinion. However, if people's aim in life is to rent forever, well, Sydney or Melbourne is for them. No harm, no foul.

I guess though for someone who wants to own their own home, enjoy work/life balance rather than spend their leisure time in a bus, SA is better than most other states. The penalty of maybe 0.5% more unemployment is a fair exchange.

You use lots of big words chief. But let's be honest, I can only compare us to WA. and I lived there for 10 years. I suggest you have a holiday and drive around our nearest competitor.

Oh, goody. Is this the point where I say the Liberals spent so much that WA now has the highest level of State Government debt per capita in the country? If I drive round, I will see lots of shiny new things?

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation ... 4c48d61445

If you bothered to read, I have backed up most of my assertions with links to the facts.

Now, I understand that this is an electioneering page, so you wouldn't be a Liberal supporter fresh from trashing WA's economy wanting to do the same here, would you?

Sorry, but how about instead of just throwing disparaging remarks about SA, you just come up with some facts?

I have been repeating this, but I shall re-repeat it. Other than bigger populations, which bring huge problems, what advantages are there in living in other States? Employment, housing costs, commuting times, State debt, school crowding? When everything is taken into account, where is this bloody nirvana SA is being compared to? At this point, I am beginning to suspect the critics have no facts.

Facts? Here's some facts..

The employment situation in SA is fucked.
Public schools ARE over crowded.
Commuting times may not be as bad as interstate, but they are fucked as well. Our roads are congested.
State debt is already through the roof.
We may not have the high median house prices of Sydney, but most people can't afford a house in the inner suburbs or surrounding areas. That's why there's big housing developments up north and even down south.

Factual enough?

The last two state budgets have been about "jobs". Where's the jobs?

[rubberman]

You use lots of big words chief. But let's be honest, I can only compare us to WA. and I lived there for 10 years. I suggest you have a holiday and drive around our nearest competitor.

Oh, goody. Is this the point where I say the Liberals spent so much that WA now has the highest level of State Government debt per capita in the country? If I drive round, I will see lots of shiny new things?

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation ... 4c48d61445

If you bothered to read, I have backed up most of my assertions with links to the facts.

Now, I understand that this is an electioneering page, so you wouldn't be a Liberal supporter fresh from trashing WA's economy wanting to do the same here, would you?

Sorry, but how about instead of just throwing disparaging remarks about SA, you just come up with some facts?

I have been repeating this, but I shall re-repeat it. Other than bigger populations, which bring huge problems, what advantages are there in living in other States? Employment, housing costs, commuting times, State debt, school crowding? When everything is taken into account, where is this bloody nirvana SA is being compared to? At this point, I am beginning to suspect the critics have no facts.

Facts? Here's some facts..

The employment situation in SA is fucked.
Public schools ARE over crowded.
Commuting times may not be as bad as interstate, but they are fucked as well. Our roads are congested.
State debt is already through the roof.
We may not have the high median house prices of Sydney, but most people can't afford a house in the inner suburbs or surrounding areas. That's why there's big housing developments up north and even down south.

Factual enough?

The last two state budgets have been about "jobs". Where's the jobs?

Rev,

With all due respect, the discussion started over the accusation that SA was a backwater.

You mentioned jobs. Queensland has higher unemployment, and while SA has higher than the national average unemployment, that's less than 1% difference. Commute times and housing affordability are better than most other states. WA has higher debt per capita.

So, ok, in the sense of happiness, friendliness and peace, let's say I agree that SA is fucked in all the areas you mention. So, even if we were to agree, the facts I have posted, and which nobody has proven wrong, show that the other States are at least as fucked, if not fucked-er.

The point is that those who reckon SA is a backwater have totally and repeatedly failed to demonstrate that somewhere else is better.

FFS people who reckon SA is a backwater, tell me where this other state of perfection is. It isn't NSW with unaffordable housing and $200m/km tramline jokes. It isn't Qld with higher unemployment. It isn't WA with higher debt. Vic has also got unaffordable housing and high commute times. So, is Tasmania the holy grail? Or the NT, or the ACT? Where is this place we are a backwater in comparison to? Christmas Island maybe?

Where is it and why?

[Ben]

You use lots of big words chief. But let's be honest, I can only compare us to WA. and I lived there for 10 years. I suggest you have a holiday and drive around our nearest competitor.

Oh, goody. Is this the point where I say the Liberals spent so much that WA now has the highest level of State Government debt per capita in the country? If I drive round, I will see lots of shiny new things?

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation ... 4c48d61445

If you bothered to read, I have backed up most of my assertions with links to the facts.

Now, I understand that this is an electioneering page, so you wouldn't be a Liberal supporter fresh from trashing WA's economy wanting to do the same here, would you?

Sorry, but how about instead of just throwing disparaging remarks about SA, you just come up with some facts?

I have been repeating this, but I shall re-repeat it. Other than bigger populations, which bring huge problems, what advantages are there in living in other States? Employment, housing costs, commuting times, State debt, school crowding? When everything is taken into account, where is this bloody nirvana SA is being compared to? At this point, I am beginning to suspect the critics have no facts.

Facts? Here's some facts..

The employment situation in SA is fucked.
Public schools ARE over crowded.
Commuting times may not be as bad as interstate, but they are fucked as well. Our roads are congested.
State debt is already through the roof.
We may not have the high median house prices of Sydney, but most people can't afford a house in the inner suburbs or surrounding areas. That's why there's big housing developments up north and even down south.

Factual enough?

The last two state budgets have been about "jobs". Where's the jobs?

Rev, As usual they are not facts but merely your opinions (and others too) but opinions nevertheless.

You can't rant off a list and say they are facts. You need to back facts up with evidence. We've had this issue before...

Define "through the roof" in regards to debt.
What do you mean by employment is "fucked".
Commuting is "fucked".

I don't think this "information" has come from the ABS....

[SBD]

Commute times are bad if you live in an outer suburb and work in the CBD. Solutions to that on a personal level are 1) work near where you live or 2) live near where you work, the latter tends to be more expensive, and the former often tends to pay less.

On a population level, the solution is to have a larger number of CBDs in the state. If we built up Berri, Mount Gambier and Murray Bridge to have the scale of employment and population that Bendigo, Ballarat and the Latrobe Valley have, perhaps the state would look different. We could also add Port Pirie, Port Lincoln and Kadina to the mix.

Then it starts to look credible to restore or create regular rail (passenger and freight) services, and maintain the lines to support them, the electoral boundaries commission might not have such a hard time, and we might get back our 11th and 12th federal seats.

[Nathan]

Commute times are bad if you live in an outer suburb and work in the CBD. Solutions to that on a personal level are 1) work near where you live or 2) live near where you work, the latter tends to be more expensive, and the former often tends to pay less.

On a population level, the solution is to have a larger number of CBDs in the state. If we built up Berri, Mount Gambier and Murray Bridge to have the scale of employment and population that Bendigo, Ballarat and the Latrobe Valley have, perhaps the state would look different. We could also add Port Pirie, Port Lincoln and Kadina to the mix.

Then it starts to look credible to restore or create regular rail (passenger and freight) services, and maintain the lines to support them, the electoral boundaries commission might not have such a hard time, and we might get back our 11th and 12th federal seats.

The problem is those towns will resist growth. Look at the fuss Mount Barker residents put up about zoning changes and housing development.

[Aidan]

My electorate's turned from Bright to Black. It seems symbolic of something.

I was going to vote for SA Best, but Nick Xenophon didn't bother fielding a candidate Instead we have a mediocre independent (Rob de Jonge) who claims to stand for SA Better. No good policies, and his promotional pamphlets show he likes to take credit for the achievements of others. I generally favour independents, but I think I'll make an exception this time.

Labor and Liberal both deserve to lose. Their infrastructure decisions (and indeed their economic decisions) show a terrible lack of long term vision. Indeed they don't even seem to know what long term vision is - they appear to think it means foisting poorly scrutinised plans onto Adelaide.

Greens, Conservatives and Dignity don't seem to be much better. Despite Dignity's name change, they're still little more than a single issue party. Conservatives seem to want to strip the government of much of its funding. Greens don't even want population growth.

But my local member (David Speirs) has done fairly well. So despite their abysmal record last time they were in government, it looks like the Liberals will get my vote.

[rev]

Oh, goody. Is this the point where I say the Liberals spent so much that WA now has the highest level of State Government debt per capita in the country? If I drive round, I will see lots of shiny new things?

https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation ... 4c48d61445

If you bothered to read, I have backed up most of my assertions with links to the facts.

Now, I understand that this is an electioneering page, so you wouldn't be a Liberal supporter fresh from trashing WA's economy wanting to do the same here, would you?

Sorry, but how about instead of just throwing disparaging remarks about SA, you just come up with some facts?

I have been repeating this, but I shall re-repeat it. Other than bigger populations, which bring huge problems, what advantages are there in living in other States? Employment, housing costs, commuting times, State debt, school crowding? When everything is taken into account, where is this bloody nirvana SA is being compared to? At this point, I am beginning to suspect the critics have no facts.

Facts? Here's some facts..

The employment situation in SA is fucked.
Public schools ARE over crowded.
Commuting times may not be as bad as interstate, but they are fucked as well. Our roads are congested.
State debt is already through the roof.
We may not have the high median house prices of Sydney, but most people can't afford a house in the inner suburbs or surrounding areas. That's why there's big housing developments up north and even down south.

Factual enough?

The last two state budgets have been about "jobs". Where's the jobs?

Rev, As usual they are not facts but merely your opinions (and others too) but opinions nevertheless.

You can't rant off a list and say they are facts. You need to back facts up with evidence. We've had this issue before...

Define "through the roof" in regards to debt.
What do you mean by employment is "fucked".
Commuting is "fucked".

I don't think this "information" has come from the ABS....

So show me how the job market is so great..
Show me how great our roads are...
Show me how our public schools have an adequate ratio of teachers to students..

lol the ABS...what, you need links to verify the reality around you? Well, not surprising..

[rev]

Commute times are bad if you live in an outer suburb and work in the CBD. Solutions to that on a personal level are 1) work near where you live or 2) live near where you work, the latter tends to be more expensive, and the former often tends to pay less.

Problem with this is it ignores the reality for many people..

1) Your line of work or job isn't always available close to where you live
2) People who live in the outer suburbs do so because that is where they can afford to live. Not everyone can afford to live close to the city or inner suburbs with semi industrial zones where they might work.

On a population level, the solution is to have a larger number of CBDs in the state. If we built up Berri, Mount Gambier and Murray Bridge to have the scale of employment and population that Bendigo, Ballarat and the Latrobe Valley have, perhaps the state would look different. We could also add Port Pirie, Port Lincoln and Kadina to the mix.

Then it starts to look credible to restore or create regular rail (passenger and freight) services, and maintain the lines to support them, the electoral boundaries commission might not have such a hard time, and we might get back our 11th and 12th federal seats.

Our politicians would probably botch it up like they botch everything else up.

[SBD]

Commute times are bad if you live in an outer suburb and work in the CBD. Solutions to that on a personal level are 1) work near where you live or 2) live near where you work, the latter tends to be more expensive, and the former often tends to pay less.

On a population level, the solution is to have a larger number of CBDs in the state. If we built up Berri, Mount Gambier and Murray Bridge to have the scale of employment and population that Bendigo, Ballarat and the Latrobe Valley have, perhaps the state would look different. We could also add Port Pirie, Port Lincoln and Kadina to the mix.

Then it starts to look credible to restore or create regular rail (passenger and freight) services, and maintain the lines to support them, the electoral boundaries commission might not have such a hard time, and we might get back our 11th and 12th federal seats.

The problem is those towns will resist growth. Look at the fuss Mount Barker residents put up about zoning changes and housing development.

Mount Barker stopped being a country town a long time ago. People commute from there to Adelaide, so it's just another suburb with nice scenery, the same with Gawler. They are no longer separate towns with their own community and industry.

Elizabeth in the 1950s was probably close, but improved transport means it is now just part of Adelaide. The larger cities we used to have were based on industries that don't employ so many people any more. Maybe Gupta will employ more people around Whyalla, but probably not the diversity of industry it used to have when there was also a shipyard. Forestry doesn't employ as many people around Mount Gambier or fruit blocks in the Riverland any more. Murray Bridge has a chance, but it might be too close to Adelaide to grow and still retain a distinct character. Food production and mining seem to be the only industries that have a chance of establishing and growing outside of Adelaide.

[Aidan]

One thing conspicuously absent from this election campaign was the expected policy announcement by SA Best to extend the Metroticket buses to some country areas including Murray Bridge. Did I blink and miss it? Or have they grown cold on the idea?

[rev]

Exit Poll on 9 predicts Liberal/Marshall win 50.5% to Labor/Weatheril 49.5%

Primary Vote
Lib 36%
Lab 31%
SAB 15%
Greens 8%


Wow, 8%. What's wrong with those people? Overdosing on prescription meds, or hitting the ice pipe a bit hard last night?


Let's see how accurate this turns out to be..hopefully, for South Australia's sake, Marshall doesn't become premier.

[Nathan]

Wow, 8%. What's wrong with those people? Overdosing on prescription meds, or hitting the ice pipe a bit hard last night?

Absolutely uncalled for.