News & Discussion: Cycling

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AtD
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News & Discussion: Cycling

#1 Post by AtD » Tue Dec 27, 2005 2:13 am

More ACC brilliance. I wondered down Frome Road today and saw this:

Image

This is weird for several reasons. For starters it’s only on one side of the road, although, they might not be finished yet. Secondly, rather than put the bike lane on the road where it belongs, it’s on the footpath thus endangering pedestrians.

As Algernon said on IRC, when adding bike access they saw it better to take away pedestrian access rather than road access. Frome Road narrows to two lanes behind the photo, so a bike lane either side of the road would be no great loss.

The whole strip is very pedestrian un-friendly as it is. Although there are several pedestrian crossings, they’re all in the wrong spots. For example, the main entrance to the Adelaide Uni Med School is directly opposite a gate into the rest of the campus, so the majority of students walk in a straight line between the two. There are pedestrian crossings about 100m either side of this spot, both of which are hardly used. One’s too far north and away from the most of the buildings along the road so is hardly ever used.

IMO, bikes don’t belong on footpaths and pedestrians are more important than cars.

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#2 Post by Algernon » Tue Dec 27, 2005 2:18 am

Just to elaborate on one thing, this is not the sort of thing that just pops up in someone's head and gets built. Rather, if someone at council really wanted that bike lane, then they would've gone for something a whole lot more practical but then have to 'compromise' with this in the end.

It all goes to show why I believe decision making should not be made by groups of people, rather it should solely be the domain of a dictator such as myself. :idea:

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#3 Post by AG » Tue Dec 27, 2005 11:40 pm

And how exactly does this improve bicycle access or pedestrian access along the eastern side of Frome Road? :\

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#4 Post by Al » Wed Dec 28, 2005 2:40 pm

AG wrote:And how exactly does this improve bicycle access or pedestrian access along the eastern side of Frome Road? :\
It formally allows cyclists to run up the behind of unsuspecting pedestrians! :D

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News & Discussion: Cycling Infrastructure

#5 Post by olliepee » Sat Apr 04, 2009 10:13 pm

I thought with Adelaide's recent Lance injection there would be more talk on this on here...

I cycle to and from work everyday (when Im not catching the tram) and I have to say cycling in Adelaide (or out of Adelaide) is aweful. And i'm shocked that there aren't any more nice, sceneic cycle trials or paths like linear path... Surely the parklands are crying out for development for this purpose!!!

For a city that holds the southern hemispheres premiere cycing event, cycle lanes around the city are terrible. I personally would love to see Adelaide pushing towards a greener future and introduce more dedicated cycle lanes in and out of the city, and dedicated cycle paths. What is going on with the supposed City to Glenelg path planned for aside the tram???

It just seems that for such a manageable (to cycle around) city, we totally lack any kind of cycle infrastructure!

anyone else got any thoughts on this topic?

ollie

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#6 Post by Prince George » Sun Apr 05, 2009 1:14 am

I wasn't a bike-commuter in Adelaide, but I have been for a while now over here in Seattle. One of the things that makes it feel easier over here than back in SA is not so much more facilities (although there is a bit more; then again, it's a bigger city), but more respect for cyclist's "right to exist". I've only ridden to downtown Seattle once, and even though the streets were plenty busy I didn't feel like I was in much danger at all; my impression is that the attitude of Adelaide's drivers is much less accomodating. It's a shame to think that Adelaide, with some advantages over Seattle viz-a-vis cycling (it's way flatter, it's warmer, it has a major cycling event), has not managed to cultivate as much of a pro-bike mindset.

One other simple difference between the two is that the speed limits are lower here. The base speed limit across the city is 25 mph (40 kph), the major arterial streets are 30 mph (48 kph), and only the largest roads (other than the freeways) are 35 (56). Many of the residential streets are also narrower - parked cars on each side reduce them down to not much more than a single driving lane - which slows people down even further. Slower streets are safer streets, which also makes cycling more attractive even without bike-paths everywhere.

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#7 Post by bdm » Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:07 am

Adelaide's cycle lanes are indeed shocking -- I've been hit twice in the last year. I don't know why just a small amount of expenditure cannot be moved from car-based development to bike-based. Every bike on the road means one less car there clogging up traffic, less pollution, a healthier population... the government doesn't need to abnormally "support" bikes, it just needs to be fair!

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#8 Post by mattblack » Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:32 am

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Last edited by mattblack on Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:37 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#9 Post by mattblack » Sun Apr 05, 2009 10:33 am

If you have issues with bike paths give Clr Yarwood the information of where specific problems are and he will pass it on to the relevant people in the council. Ive just told him about the connectivity issues asssociated with the parklands trail and other paths that come in from the suburbs like Anzac Hwy and the crooke st paths. Anyway, dont just give him an email saying the whole system is crap, tell him the spots that need attention and they will look into it.

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#10 Post by jk1237 » Sun Apr 05, 2009 8:18 pm

Its true that we spend the least on cycling infrastructure for any city, but I still wouldnt say its awful. I like riding around the city. I ride to work every 2nd day and there could be a lot of improvement though. Im waiting on the separated Sturt St cycle lane to be done, to see how that will go. Ive noticed even more people riding around the city lately, and streets that are quite unsafe are the whole of North Tce, King William Street north and Grenfell /Currie Streets. Personally I do prefer marked bike lanes, but as Prince George once said, marked bike lanes can sometimes be more dangerous as cars whiz past you faster and dont look out for you at all. There are bike lanes in Rundle Street east that are hopeless, as taxis and cars park right in the middle of them constantly, and when pdestrians cross the road they immediately step into the bike lane, then they decide to look at whats oncoming instead of looking before they step over the kerb

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#11 Post by Wayno » Sun Apr 05, 2009 9:03 pm

The CBD is ok, but i'm too scared to ride the suburban roads into the city.
Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work.

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#12 Post by olliepee » Mon Apr 06, 2009 10:06 pm

Yeah, the CBD is ok, much better than a lot of cities... but I still would say it'd put off 30% of potential commuters due to some oddities (cars parking in the bike lanes, bike lanes suddenly ending, etc).

The rural/suburban lanes are much worse. I'd personally love to see more divided bike lanes along some key commuting roads that lead into the cbd and for something larger im working on some photoshop montages :-)

Also, I think part of the problem is the connectivity between Adelaide's transport. I'd be more than happy to get on the train to marion, get on the River Sturt linear park, join up with the Veloway... if only I knew about it! Signage and advertising is aweful, Adelaide Metro's website is NO help at all and is HORRIBLE and dated to use, the ticketting system is also very confusing...

I didnt even know that this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adelaide_Southern_Veloway - existed as I live in the inner suburbs, surely if I go on Adelaide Metro's website I should be able to find information about this kind of thing??

I'd love to see technology used by the ACC more in general... where's my iphone metro application and why do they have 1million different transport websites!? :-) It seems there are lots of great sa tourism websites and as soon as you get here people woud become lost!

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#13 Post by Omicron » Tue Apr 07, 2009 12:09 am

The simple answer is that cars and bikes should not mix. At all. A two-tonne metal box should not be passing within inches of a lightweight piece of bent metal rod, especially on road spaces that are not designed for such interactions (and that's not to imply that the painting of lines on bitumen is an adequate means for allowing cars and bikes to share the roadway). For bike lanes to be sufficiently patronised, they must be entirely separated from the road and cars, or you'll only attract riders who are sufficiently experienced and confident to overcome the continual intrusions and risks presented by riding near traffic. Until such time, I doubt ridership will increase by any useful amount.

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#14 Post by olliepee » Tue Apr 07, 2009 12:40 am

Omicron wrote:not to imply that the painting of lines on bitumen is an adequate means for allowing cars and bikes to share the roadway...
I completly agree! there are obviously some places where dividing up the road just wouldn't work... I really like the simple way this recent image of the proposed rundle street dealt with that problem:

Image

The other problem is that statistics show that when you seperate the bike and roads, actually more accidents occur because of the lack of attention intersections and cross roads... so something would need to be done to fix that problem.

I really loved an illustration that was in the Adelaide Review about 6 months back now, showing a glass tube filled with cyclists going over the torrens... Although it was pretty sci-fi, it wasn't miles away from an idea like: ImageImage

Other really interesting ideas for CBD integration (and much more realistic) of dedicated walking/cycle lanes: http://www.biketrans.com/ and http://www.biketrans.com/info.html (this I would LOVE to see incorporated into a new victoria square design; these skylanes flowing down king william over the tramline)

Imagine exiting this while looking at a new Victoria Square, opening out to a beautiful piazza with beautiful restaurants and cafes... Image

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Re: Cycling around Adelaide

#15 Post by Norman » Tue Apr 07, 2009 12:44 am

olliepee wrote:Yeah, the CBD is ok, much better than a lot of cities... but I still would say it'd put off 30% of potential commuters due to some oddities (cars parking in the bike lanes, bike lanes suddenly ending, etc).

The rural/suburban lanes are much worse. I'd personally love to see more divided bike lanes along some key commuting roads that lead into the cbd and for something larger im working on some photoshop montages :-)

Also, I think part of the problem is the connectivity between Adelaide's transport. I'd be more than happy to get on the train to marion, get on the River Sturt linear park, join up with the Veloway... if only I knew about it! Signage and advertising is aweful, Adelaide Metro's website is NO help at all and is HORRIBLE and dated to use, the ticketting system is also very confusing...

I didnt even know that this - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adelaide_Southern_Veloway - existed as I live in the inner suburbs, surely if I go on Adelaide Metro's website I should be able to find information about this kind of thing??

I'd love to see technology used by the ACC more in general... where's my iphone metro application and why do they have 1million different transport websites!? :-) It seems there are lots of great sa tourism websites and as soon as you get here people woud become lost!
I'm not sure why the Adelaide Metro should be displaying Bike information, but for more information on bike trails and lanes, go to Bike SA.

http://www.bikesa.asn.au/

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