News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#946 Post by SRW » Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:38 pm

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#947 Post by PeFe » Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:57 pm

Is it just me or do other people find the reporting on the proposed bus route changes really quite strange in the sense that all the articles focus on the "number of bus stops lost"....

No substantive investigation on proposed frequency or cost or efficiency or coverage (I suppose "losing bus stops" is as about as close to coverage as we get)

So if you someone proposed more bus stops along Port Road for example, that would be a win for public transport users because more bus stops = better public transport.... :roll:

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#948 Post by noted » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:22 pm

PeFe wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:57 pm
Is it just me or do other people find the reporting on the proposed bus route changes really quite strange in the sense that all the articles focus on the "number of bus stops lost"....

No substantive investigation on proposed frequency or cost or efficiency or coverage (I suppose "losing bus stops" is as about as close to coverage as we get)

So if you someone proposed more bus stops along Port Road for example, that would be a win for public transport users because more bus stops = better public transport.... :roll:
Yes and no. Ideally the media would conduct a more 'substantive investigation' but unfortunately this sort of low hanging fruit stuff is pretty typical. The Government really should have been better prepared for it. To date Knoll has done a pretty poor job of selling it.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#949 Post by SBD » Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:44 pm

noted wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:22 pm
PeFe wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:57 pm
Is it just me or do other people find the reporting on the proposed bus route changes really quite strange in the sense that all the articles focus on the "number of bus stops lost"....

No substantive investigation on proposed frequency or cost or efficiency or coverage (I suppose "losing bus stops" is as about as close to coverage as we get)

So if you someone proposed more bus stops along Port Road for example, that would be a win for public transport users because more bus stops = better public transport.... :roll:
Yes and no. Ideally the media would conduct a more 'substantive investigation' but unfortunately this sort of low hanging fruit stuff is pretty typical. The Government really should have been better prepared for it. To date Knoll has done a pretty poor job of selling it.
I rarely use buses, but had a quick look and determined that the closest bus stop to home will remain the closest stop, and the buses in the area will cover the same roads and feed to the same railway stations, but with the routes composed in a slightly different layout.

I wonder if the focus on number of bus stops is the focus as that is the largest criticism the ALP could find? Koutsantonis and Malinauskas are complaining today that Route 232 will be lost, through Malinauskas' electorate. That appears to be true (replaced by route 22), but it was going to be changed anyway since it presently crosses South Road at Pym Street (which will be closed as part of R2P), and the new route will use Regency, South and Torrens Roads instead.

The current route uses Harrison, Pym and Days to get from Torrens Road to Regency Road as part of a route between Port Adelaide and Adelaide. The alternative to the South Road route 22 would seem to be to run 22A on Days Road and 22B on Harrison Road, each only getting service at "Connector" frequency instead of "Go Zone"

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#950 Post by flat04 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:33 pm

It appears the Urrbrae campuses of Uni SA and Tafe have been disregarded. The service that was going down Waite Rd looks to be discontinued and the closest bus to the City is more than 1km away at The Tollgate or Fullarton Rd. I'd think it's a mistake to drop that service. Interesting that they negotiate the contracts then put the routes out for public consultation....

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#951 Post by Columbo » Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:09 pm

SBD wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 3:44 pm
noted wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:22 pm
PeFe wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 12:57 pm
Is it just me or do other people find the reporting on the proposed bus route changes really quite strange in the sense that all the articles focus on the "number of bus stops lost"....

No substantive investigation on proposed frequency or cost or efficiency or coverage (I suppose "losing bus stops" is as about as close to coverage as we get)

So if you someone proposed more bus stops along Port Road for example, that would be a win for public transport users because more bus stops = better public transport.... :roll:
Yes and no. Ideally the media would conduct a more 'substantive investigation' but unfortunately this sort of low hanging fruit stuff is pretty typical. The Government really should have been better prepared for it. To date Knoll has done a pretty poor job of selling it.
I rarely use buses, but had a quick look and determined that the closest bus stop to home will remain the closest stop, and the buses in the area will cover the same roads and feed to the same railway stations, but with the routes composed in a slightly different layout.

I wonder if the focus on number of bus stops is the focus as that is the largest criticism the ALP could find? Koutsantonis and Malinauskas are complaining today that Route 232 will be lost, through Malinauskas' electorate. That appears to be true (replaced by route 22), but it was going to be changed anyway since it presently crosses South Road at Pym Street (which will be closed as part of R2P), and the new route will use Regency, South and Torrens Roads instead.

The current route uses Harrison, Pym and Days to get from Torrens Road to Regency Road as part of a route between Port Adelaide and Adelaide. The alternative to the South Road route 22 would seem to be to run 22A on Days Road and 22B on Harrison Road, each only getting service at "Connector" frequency instead of "Go Zone"
The 230/232 is my local bus service which I use on average 4-5 times per week to get to and from work, Arndale or the city, getting on along Harrison Road. As you pointed out the change for the Days Rd, Pym St and Harrison Rd section was going to happen regardless of any other network changes that were or weren't planned, and could start as early as August. I emailed Peter Malinauskas recently and received what I suspected to be a generic reply but was pleasantly surprised to see he rode the 232 today, albeit as it relates to the loss of Newcastle St more than the changes due to R2P.

The route that has been chosen is the clearly the most logical, and the 10-15 minute frequency is great. However, if the stops are laid out as shown on the original plan that was available at R2P info sessions last year, it will make this change quite difficult for many residents. (Those stops were Regency Tafe, Regency/South, Pym/South, Torrens/South, and the 2 Footy Express stops on Torrens Rd). Until 5 or so years ago there was a service along that same route that was cut and rightfully so due to lack of patronage and back then the South Rd wasn't what it was about to become, so the uptake once it is the only option will be interesting.

Many local residents (young and old) in the Croydon Park, Dudley Park, Devon Park and Renown Park area use the service for direct access to Arndale, and whilst that will still exist the distance to access the service will be very different. This is further compounded by the planned loss of the 239 that provides another option to Arndale or Churchill Shopping Centre for those who are closer to Churchill Road. There is also the train but as it stands it's not alot of use for people wanting to get to the nearest shops.

So what are the other options?
A service along Days Rd would be better for the people on the Western Side of South Road, could mean just 1 stop on Pym St is lost, the one closest to South Rd, the other one is only about 30m from the corner of Days Rd.

But how do you keep a service along Harrison Rd?
Regency Rd, Pedder Crescent, Islington Station, Exeter Terrace, Pym St, Harrison Rd to Torrens Rd. (and the reverse on the way back)
It would be a bit of overlap with the 300/301 but would only be 3 extra stops than now, but would provide access to 2 railway stations (Islington & Ovingham)
Part of the R2P upgrade is a new road for heavy vehicles parallel to the freight line behind the spotless linen factory to link up with Exeter Terrace near Balfours factory.

As a local I'd almost prefer a modified current route at a reduced frequency than the planned one at higher frequency. I know you can't consult everyone but for all the info we have received about the South Road works, an opportunity to give feedback about changes to the buses would have been valuable.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#952 Post by notmichaeljfox » Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:27 pm

flat04 wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:33 pm
It appears the Urrbrae campuses of Uni SA and Tafe have been disregarded. The service that was going down Waite Rd looks to be discontinued and the closest bus to the City is more than 1km away at The Tollgate or Fullarton Rd. I'd think it's a mistake to drop that service. Interesting that they negotiate the contracts then put the routes out for public consultation....
I work at Flinders Uni and most of the routes are cut or have replacements that are no longer stopping there. The express service is gone and I feel like it's going to take everyone longer to get to the main precinct.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#953 Post by ginzahikari » Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:10 pm

Does anyone have a digital version of the map with all the bus stops cut as shown by Labor on the news today?

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#954 Post by SBD » Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:17 pm

ginzahikari wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:10 pm
Does anyone have a digital version of the map with all the bus stops cut as shown by Labor on the news today?
I'd be curious to also know how many new bus stops there will be to offset the announced "cuts". I wondered why it was only the last day or so that Labor has "discovered" that the ""poor outer suburbs" such as Davoren Park (in a Labor electorate) will be losing stops, so I looked at the maps.

The route on Heytesbury/Coventry Road (near Broadmeadows railway station) is moved west to use Peachey Road. The route presently on Peachey Road is moved west to Stebonheath Road. Stebonheath Road did not have any bus service at all, but has a housing estate still growing on its western side. The proposed new route layout leaves a bit of a hole in the area around the corner of Coventry and Davoren Roads, but not as big as the hole where the Eyre development is. The development that gets improved service is in the same Labor electorate as the area that loses the bus service.

"Eventually" a new route may be required through Eyre and near the new developments of Brookmont Estate (Andrews Farm) and Almond Grove (Munno Para West) which do not presently have any public transport service.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#955 Post by Eurostar » Thu Jun 25, 2020 11:06 pm

SBD wrote:
Thu Jun 25, 2020 2:17 pm
ginzahikari wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 10:10 pm
Does anyone have a digital version of the map with all the bus stops cut as shown by Labor on the news today?
I'd be curious to also know how many new bus stops there will be to offset the announced "cuts". I wondered why it was only the last day or so that Labor has "discovered" that the ""poor outer suburbs" such as Davoren Park (in a Labor electorate) will be losing stops, so I looked at the maps.

The route on Heytesbury/Coventry Road (near Broadmeadows railway station) is moved west to use Peachey Road. The route presently on Peachey Road is moved west to Stebonheath Road. Stebonheath Road did not have any bus service at all, but has a housing estate still growing on its western side. The proposed new route layout leaves a bit of a hole in the area around the corner of Coventry and Davoren Roads, but not as big as the hole where the Eyre development is. The development that gets improved service is in the same Labor electorate as the area that loses the bus service.

"Eventually" a new route may be required through Eyre and near the new developments of Brookmont Estate (Andrews Farm) and Almond Grove (Munno Para West) which do not presently have any public transport service.
Maybe the former 450 should be reinstated, it could run in afternoon peak running between Elizabeth Station and Andrews Farm (President Avenue shops) , this means 451 in afternoon peak could be a shortworking between Elizabeth Station and Andrews Farm (Brookmont)

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#956 Post by I Follow PAFC » Sun Jun 28, 2020 7:50 pm

The State Government looks set to back down from its controversial plan to cut hundreds of bus stops and routes.
https://www.facebook.com/9NewsAdelaide/ ... 154677031/
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https://www.facebook.com/IFollowThePAFC/

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#957 Post by Eurostar » Mon Jun 29, 2020 12:07 pm

I will like to see 228X run via Obahn

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#958 Post by Brucetiki » Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:17 pm

I Follow PAFC wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 7:50 pm
The State Government looks set to back down from its controversial plan to cut hundreds of bus stops and routes.
https://www.facebook.com/9NewsAdelaide/ ... 154677031/
An epic fail from Knoll.

Now he needs to fall on his sword and resign as minister.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#959 Post by SBD » Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:39 pm

Brucetiki wrote:
Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:17 pm
I Follow PAFC wrote:
Sun Jun 28, 2020 7:50 pm
The State Government looks set to back down from its controversial plan to cut hundreds of bus stops and routes.
https://www.facebook.com/9NewsAdelaide/ ... 154677031/
An epic fail from Knoll.

Now he needs to fall on his sword and resign as minister.
It might have been a good idea overall (with some tweaks) - certainly there were some good aspects of the whole package. The whole package is now dumped, but some aspects will still be needed. Should he fall on his sword for proposing something that wasn't popular, or for listening to popular opinion and dropping it during consultation instead of sticking to what he believed was the best way forward? I think the government did a poor job of advertising the positive aspects of the proposed changes, but it has been a bit preoccupied with other things for a few months.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Buses

#960 Post by PeFe » Mon Jun 29, 2020 1:53 pm

Weak as piss....No courage in their own convictions.....absolutely no commitment to what promised to be doing.

I expected Knoll to bow to some sort of public pressure and limit the cuts to some bus routes......but to just dump the whole thing...that is just ridiculous.

The Labor Party was planning to make outer suburbs buses terminate at train stations as well (Gawler and Flinders line)

And what about the simplification of the bus routes numbers.....who would have opposed that?

Talk about throwing out the baby with the bath water..

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