[COM] South Road Superway | $842m | 3km

Threads relating to transport, water, etc. within the CBD and Metropolitan area.
Message
Author
crawf
Donating Member
Donating Member
Posts: 5415
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2006 7:49 pm
Location: Adelaide
Has thanked: 176 times
Been thanked: 320 times

[COM]

#16 Post by crawf » Wed Mar 01, 2006 3:23 am

Hi Every1, I'm New

Great Renders Al!!!!!!!!!!

Wow Ive never seen pics of the South Road Upgrade like that
it loooks fantastic!!!!!!!!!

also this site is fantastic!!!!, 10/10, glad i found it

User avatar
Howie
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 4792
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:55 pm
Location: Adelaide
Has thanked: 72 times
Been thanked: 41 times

[COM]

#17 Post by Howie » Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:52 am

Welcome crawf_231. I'm glad you could make the jump from SSC. Looks like we've got most of the good people from there here on S-A and none of the kiddies.

I absolutely agree with all of the points made above. A measly 20 million on our tram extension, and a massive $120 million on this underpass doesn't quite stack up. Yet organisations such as the RAA have been the most critical of the tram extension... it's not half obvious who's trying to further their own agenda.

Additionally, i wasn't too happy to read today that Rann is signing a decree never to install tolls while he's leading the government. How does he expect to pay for freeways and/or our backlog of maintenance?

bdm
High Rise Poster!
Posts: 209
Joined: Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:58 pm

[COM]

#18 Post by bdm » Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:07 am

Because Rann is pandering to those in the state that don't want it to move forward (lots of people, and because we're ageing - there'll simply be more in years to come).

User avatar
Al
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 560
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:34 pm
Location: Wild Wild West

[COM]

#19 Post by Al » Wed Mar 01, 2006 11:17 am

Actually, the topic of tolls is quite an important one. There's been discussion here at my office about a recent 4 Corners program on the ABC about the tolls installed in the eastern states. I didn't see the particular episode but the main thrust of it was that the tolls have actually made public roads a lot worse. Apparently, there are a few of previous premiers of the eastern states have taken up key positions in the private transport companies operating these tolls (eg. Bob Carr is now with Macquarie which controls the Sydney Cross City tunnel) but whilst in government they made decisions which encouraged the use of the tolls by closing alternative routes and reducing funding. The contracts entered into with these toll companies were very generous as well.


Here's the link to the program page.

The problem with private tolls is that they're permanant. The best tolls would be government run tolls that have an expiry after they've paid for the road in question or thereabouts.

UrbanSG
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 1848
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 8:55 am
Been thanked: 7 times

[COM]

#20 Post by UrbanSG » Wed Mar 01, 2006 11:50 am

Al I watched that episode. The toll situation in the eastern states is a real nightmare. They have got major issues that are going to arise in the future because of them. It is a very complex issue. I think if tolls were to occur it is best that the Government funds the project and then collects the returns from tolls to pay it off. There is risk involved with this but when you allow a private company to do this instead the big evil, PROFITS, get in the way and cause adverse outcomes. That is why Governments can't sell themselves off all the time and privatise everything. We need to have at least some public ownership otherwise we are screwed!


Anyway the issue is that in these massive contract papers drawn up for these private tollways in the eastern states there is actually a clause stating that if public transport improvements are made along any of the tollway catchment routes the tollway company is likely to be able to sue the Government for lost revenue due to decreased car flows as a result!!! Can it get any worse? I don't think so! That is a major worry in my opinion. I am glad we haven't gone down this path here yet in SA but who knows what may eventuate.

User avatar
Algernon
Legendary Member!
Posts: 1110
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:46 pm
Location: Moravia
Has thanked: 314 times
Been thanked: 149 times

[COM]

#21 Post by Algernon » Wed Mar 01, 2006 7:34 pm

Al wrote:Actually, the topic of tolls is quite an important one. There's been discussion here at my office about a recent 4 Corners program on the ABC about the tolls installed in the eastern states. I didn't see the particular episode but the main thrust of it was that the tolls have actually made public roads a lot worse. Apparently, there are a few of previous premiers of the eastern states have taken up key positions in the private transport companies operating these tolls (eg. Bob Carr is now with Macquarie which controls the Sydney Cross City tunnel) but whilst in government they made decisions which encouraged the use of the tolls by closing alternative routes and reducing funding. The contracts entered into with these toll companies were very generous as well.


Here's the link to the program page.

The problem with private tolls is that they're permanant. The best tolls would be government run tolls that have an expiry after they've paid for the road in question or thereabouts.
The Cross City tunnel is a really good example of how not to enter into a partnership with private firms.

The 3 main screwups were:

1) The government guaranteed the company a set profit. When the forecasted numbers didn't eventuate, the government was forced to actually pay this company to make it profitable for them.

2) Roads leading into the tunnel were all converted to one way streets. You literally get swallowed up by it :shock:

3) The government entered into a long term agreement not to make significant improvements to rail infrastructure. Can't give the competition a leg up, can we!

Serisouly - what the fuck?!

User avatar
Al
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 560
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:34 pm
Location: Wild Wild West

[COM]

#22 Post by Al » Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:00 pm

WTF!? That's one good deal if you ask me! Guaranteed a set profit!? Who signed off on this deal and are they behind bars yet? I cannot understand how tax payers money could be used to pay for a company to shaft them. I guess that's why Carr left office cause he saw the fan spinning fast.

User avatar
AG
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 1890
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 9:44 am
Location: Brisbane, QLD
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 20 times

[COM]

#23 Post by AG » Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:04 pm

Not only did the NSW government promise not to improve rail infrastructure in the city, they also shut off the former route from east to west (Druitt Street) across the CBD and made lots of restrictions to turning. There's also apparently reports that the RTA was ordered to alter traffic signal sequences at certain intersections to reduce capacity. Taylor Square is a prime example of the mess the NSW Government has made.

User avatar
Mants
Legendary Member!
Posts: 989
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 12:40 am
Location: City of Burnside
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times

[COM]

#24 Post by Mants » Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:00 pm

hi everyone, its been a while since ive visited S-A and made a post because my server would not allow me to enter the forum...

anyway, i was just wondering when the other two tunnels/underpasses are due to commence

Cheers

Mants

User avatar
Al
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 560
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:34 pm
Location: Wild Wild West

[COM]

#25 Post by Al » Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:32 pm

Mants wrote:hi everyone, its been a while since ive visited S-A and made a post because my server would not allow me to enter the forum...

anyway, i was just wondering when the other two tunnels/underpasses are due to commence

Cheers

Mants
According to the Dept for Transport, for both projects, land acquisition will occur from mid 2006 to mid 2007, service relocation to occur in 2007, major construction to begin 2008 and be completed 2010. This includes the widening of the section of South Rd between Port Rd and Torrens Rd.

User avatar
Algernon
Legendary Member!
Posts: 1110
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:46 pm
Location: Moravia
Has thanked: 314 times
Been thanked: 149 times

[COM]

#26 Post by Algernon » Wed Mar 01, 2006 11:52 pm

AG wrote:Not only did the NSW government promise not to improve rail infrastructure in the city, they also shut off the former route from east to west (Druitt Street) across the CBD and made lots of restrictions to turning. There's also apparently reports that the RTA was ordered to alter traffic signal sequences at certain intersections to reduce capacity. Taylor Square is a prime example of the mess the NSW Government has made.
Been to Sydney recently? Once the tollway to the airport opened, they went around and COVERED all the road signs directing you to the airport along free routes. I pissed myself at big signs with dashes of green paint on them.

Seriously guys, Adelaide isn't half bad when you see some of the freaky shit happening in Sydney :lol:

User avatar
ReallyBad
High Rise Poster!
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2005 9:53 pm
Location: Ascot Park
Been thanked: 1 time

[COM]

#27 Post by ReallyBad » Fri Mar 03, 2006 9:28 pm

Adelaide needs to seriously contemplate having private enterprise build new major arterials and allow Tollways, or we will end up going nowhere - literally.

User avatar
Al
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 560
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:34 pm
Location: Wild Wild West

[COM]

#28 Post by Al » Fri Mar 03, 2006 11:17 pm

ReallyBad wrote:Adelaide needs to seriously contemplate having private enterprise build new major arterials and allow Tollways, or we will end up going nowhere - literally.
If they get the same sort of deal as the one in Sydney, no thanks. I'd rather buy a hummer and deal with the cratersize pot holes.

User avatar
ReallyBad
High Rise Poster!
Posts: 148
Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2005 9:53 pm
Location: Ascot Park
Been thanked: 1 time

[COM]

#29 Post by ReallyBad » Sat Mar 04, 2006 7:34 am

I was thinking more like Brisbane - yes they to have problems, but their toll system works quite well I feel.

Adelaide's biggest problem is geographically it is long and narrow - we can't do anything about that, but if we keep doing half measures or hiding our heads in the sand, the problems going to get worse not better.

I resent the Advertiser for the failure of the MATS - while the MATS was an overkill, it did have great ideas for all public and private transport, then the Advertiser started ramming down everyone throats, that Adelaide would end up like Los Angeles - over polluted. Now most of the land for that was sold due to the State bank.

User avatar
Al
VIP Member
VIP Member
Posts: 560
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:34 pm
Location: Wild Wild West

[COM]

#30 Post by Al » Mon Mar 06, 2006 9:15 am

This is still offtopic but this is an article in today's Advertiser. Looks like the NSW Government is feeling the pressure and about time too.
Toll halved, closures reversed

05mar06

THE toll for Sydney's Cross City Tunnel will be halved for the next three months, and 12 road closures will either be reversed or will not proceed, the New South Wales Premier said today.

Morris Iemma said the tunnel operator, CrossCity Motorway Pty Ltd, would reduce the price of a one-way journey in the tunnel to $1.78 from midnight tonight.

He said the 12 surface road changes include planned changes to traffic flow in Sussex, Park and Druitt streets in the city.

The proposed permanent closure of Bourke Street north of the Eastern Distributor and south of William Street is being reviewed, he said.

Mr Iemma described the changes as a "significant first step" in repairing the relationship between the State Government and motorists.

"Under an agreement negotiated over the weekend, the toll for cars will now be set at $1.78 for east-west tunnels and 84 cents for cars using Sir John Young Crescent to access the harbour crossing," Mr Iemma said.

"These measures have been agreed after a proposal was put to the NSW Government by CCTM (CrossCity Tunnel Motorway) later on Friday and negotiated over the weekend.

"This agreement will not cost taxpayers one cent, but it should encourage motorists to use the tunnel."

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 6 guests