News & Discussion: Public Transport Contracts, Service & Policy

[claybro]

Yes I agree WA is currently awash with funds. But just remember, Perths freeways, rail infastructure, tunnels and the like commenced construction way back in the 1960's, when Perth was about 3/4 the size of Adelaide and an economy not much larger per capita by the standards of that era. They had a vision for both roads and public transport and how to build developement around it. In those days, the mining boom was in its infancy, and Perth was geographically very isolated as the Asian boom had not yet commenced. China was still a closed economy. Perths suburbs were very sparce and spread out. They kick started funding of this infastructure by a levy on fuel at the time 2c/ litre. Now after 40 years of building, there is not such a mamouth backlog of problems (although there are many bottlenecks relating to an exploding population). A quick check around Australia last week shows Adelaide had the cheapest fuel in the nation. A 5 cent per litre levy would barely be noticed in the weekly fluctuations, and whilst we enjoy the cheapest fuel in Oz, we have the worst Pulic transport and road infasturcture of any mainland capital.We already miss out on funding from the Federal Gov because our government steadfastly refuses to consider tolls or levies, and there is no comprehensive plan to present even when funding is available. We need a government with a COMPREHENSIVE transport plan, taking in all modes. Work out how much it will all cost and even if it is 20billion over 30 years then plan to fund it and plan to build it in an integrated way. Sould a mining boom ever strike SA, Adelaide simply would not be able to grow at the pace Perth has in the last 10 years as heavy transport would overwhelm Adelaides roads, and we would miss out big time as many would choose to simply fly in from other capitals as Adelaide chokes itself on inadequate transport infastructure.

[Aidan]

Yes I agree WA is currently awash with funds. But just remember, Perths freeways, rail infastructure, tunnels and the like commenced construction way back in the 1960's, when Perth was about 3/4 the size of Adelaide and an economy not much larger per capita by the standards of that era. They had a vision for both roads and public transport and how to build developement around it.

Source? I don't dispute that's the case with freeways, but (according to the ABC) Perth's rail system was neglected and their government in the 1980s wanted to close down at least one of the main lines. Fortunately public opposition forced a policy change and instead they electrified the system and built new lines.

In those days, the mining boom was in its infancy, and Perth was geographically very isolated as the Asian boom had not yet commenced. China was still a closed economy. Perths suburbs were very sparce and spread out. They kick started funding of this infrastructure by a levy on fuel at the time 2c/ litre. Now after 40 years of building, there is not such a mamouth backlog of problems (although there are many bottlenecks relating to an exploding population). A quick check around Australia last week shows Adelaide had the cheapest fuel in the nation. A 5 cent per litre levy would barely be noticed in the weekly fluctuations,

But could our state government impose such a levy? ISTR the courts said no.

and whilst we enjoy the cheapest fuel in Oz, we have the worst Pulic transport and road infasturcture of any mainland capital.We already miss out on funding from the Federal Gov because our government steadfastly refuses to consider tolls or levies, and there is no comprehensive plan to present even when funding is available. We need a government with a COMPREHENSIVE transport plan, taking in all modes. Work out how much it will all cost and even if it is 20billion over 30 years then plan to fund it and plan to build it in an integrated way.

True, but being comprehensive isn't enough- it also needs to be good, and it needs to be open to scrutiny.

Sould a mining boom ever strike SA, Adelaide simply would not be able to grow at the pace Perth has in the last 10 years as heavy transport would overwhelm Adelaides roads, and we would miss out big time as many would choose to simply fly in from other capitals as Adelaide chokes itself on inadequate transport infastructure.

Inadequate transport infrastructure isn't just an Adelaide problem - it's pretty bad in Sydney as well, as the infrastructure's failed to keep pace with the growth of the city.

[claybro]

Aidan, I have here explained how a city, almost identical to Adelaide 40 years ago managed to drag itself into the modern era, even without massive mining royalties. All it took was a comprehensive plan, and a willingness to find funding.Yes Perth for a short while considered closing 1 line...but the new freeways were planned with wide medians to cater for rail lines, so any lines that where to be closed where to be replaced with new lines.A WA transport minister of the 80's even travelled to Adelaide when toying with the idea of OBahns in the middle of the freeways. They went away convinced that the buses would not have enough capacity to cope(smart in hindsight), and therefore the freeway train lines where developed. And your response, typical of so many in Adelaide is..shouldnt, cant, wont, not needed yet..too expensive.. no money. Please advise of your ideas for infastructure funding? The Federal government has made it quite clear that unless the state is willing to find funds by either tolls or levys, they will withhold funding. If a state levy is unlawful...then change the law. If the concern is accountability of funds, then set up a comittee to monitor the spending. If tolls are unpopular, then build the infastructure by announcing the tollway at the time of construction so there is no hidden agenda. At present, we have no comprehensive plan good bad or otherwise to present to the Federal Government, or any willingness to find alternative direct streams of revenue to co- fund future transport infastructure.

[Norman]

The Federal Government never said that they would reduce funding without us adding tolls or levies. That was a comment made by DPTI CEO Rod Hook, which was picked up and exaggerated in the media. In fact, the government made a statement to say that was not the case. Whether you believe them or not is one thing, but there has been no official announcement to support that condition on SA receiving funds and grants for major road projects.

Sent from my RM-821_im_mea3_306 using Board Express

[claybro]

The Federal Government never said that they would reduce funding without us adding tolls or levies

It would be nice to know therefore why SA attracts less infastrucutre funding per capita than the other states. Many large projects attract Federal fundung on a joint funding arrangement with the states. As we aparently have no means of attracting state funds to co fund, we are missing out on Federal funding. Fact is neither party in this state has come up with a plan to increase infastructure spend other than massive borrowing.The opposotion apparently wants to reduce tax. Thats great, but other than sacking masses of public servants, where do they intend to get money from to fund, The Northern connector/ South Road imprvements/ further electrification of rail/ Oaklands grade separation/Tram extensions/Darlington interchange???Watch all these get canned if the Libs get in. If Labour hangs on, then they also need to explain a FUNDED timeline for these projects, instead of just unfunded glossy ideas of isolated projects. That we here get bogged down in who said what and when, instead of constructive ideas for new areas of revenue is a worry.

[Norman]

I don't have much information about how much we receive on a per-capita basis, but is that based on a state or city population? I would also like to see this proportion on a per-$GSP amount as well.

[claybro]

It is based on state population Norman. We receive less money per head of pupulation as a state for federally funded road projects than any mainland state. Floods in QLD?...well lets cancell a project or two in Adelaide (our poorest capital) to fund repairs to infastructure in our second wealthiest state. No cancellation of freeways/bus tunnels or new tramways for them thanks. We also as a state have the lowest base of tax revenue on the mainland ie the least amount of population, paying the lowest amount of tax. Unless we are prepared to come up with more ways of raising revenue, we will not grow, or even maintain the status quo of our infastructure. Yes there has been a big increase in infastructure spending by this government, but this has really only addressed the 30 year backlog, and massively increased our debt. Already many of the proposals have been delayed, wound back, or cancelled for the forseeable future. I dont hold out much hope that in the next state election either party will have the guts to stand up and introduce more user pays revenue collecting.

[crawf]

Noticed at Mawson Lakes station that the yellow destination screens have been replaced with the new LED screens found at recent station upgrades. Eg Adelaide, Hallett Cove.

Minor improvement but they look smart and more informative.

[muzzamo]

Afternoon Metrocard Champions,

Topping up your Metrocard is now even easier with online recharge.

Metrocard online recharge and auto recharge is now available when logging on to your Metrocard website account.
For an online recharge or your first auto recharge you should allow up to 24 hours for the recharge to process.

More information about online recharge is available on the Adelaide Metro website.
http://adelaidemetro.com.au/Tickets/Met ... -metrocard

Kind Regards,
Metrocard Project Team

[Verbatim9]

Caught the 99C City loop the other day from Fringe, it was one of those new busses with the red front. Anyway they had Automated Audible announcements enabled, each time the bus stopped and the front door opened an announcement would come over the internal PA "99C City Loop" It reminds me when I was in Hawaii about 2 Years back its great for tourists and non regular PT users. Now they just have to install the visual screens for the upcoming stops

[BradJC]

Apologies in advance for asking a stuid question....

If the top up trigger is $5 (less than 2 trips worth), and it can take 24 hours for the recharge to activate, is it theoretically possible to run out of credit?

Should the trigger not be, say, $10?

I doubt this is how it works. Once you're below threshold, the validator will automatically credit your Metrocard with your preselected amount. In the evening, the transaction is uploaded to the processing server which will then trigger a charge to your nominated credit card (a card that would already be verified as valid). Using this method, you will never run out of credit.

This is just a guess, by the way.

[Norman]

I've been using the auto recharge system for a few weeks now and I've never run out of credit. Probably had about 4 recharges so far.

Sent from my RM-821_im_mea3_306 using Board Express

[Allkai]

Apologies in advance for asking a stuid question....

If the top up trigger is $5 (less than 2 trips worth), and it can take 24 hours for the recharge to activate, is it theoretically possible to run out of credit?

Should the trigger not be, say, $10?

I doubt this is how it works. Once you're below threshold, the validator will automatically credit your Metrocard with your preselected amount. In the evening, the transaction is uploaded to the processing server which will then trigger a charge to your nominated credit card (a card that would already be verified as valid). Using this method, you will never run out of credit.

This is just a guess, by the way.

Ah that makes sense. The recharge is instantaneous, but the payment processing can be later.

Thanks.

[Archer]

Ah that makes sense. The recharge is instantaneous, but the payment processing can be later.

Thanks.

How would that work if the payment was declined for say, Insufficient Funds or an Expired Card? Isn't there the potential then for the recharge to have been made and the payment for that recharge later declined? I wouldn't think that it would work that way to avoid exactly this issue.

[Tonsley213]

It's more to do with the fact the the visible database(the one that operates the website) is updated less frequently than the one that runs the ticketing system. If you read at the bottom of the page when you are loged into mc.adelaidemetro.com.au.