News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

Threads relating to transport, water, etc. within the CBD and Metropolitan area.
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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1786 Post by Waewick » Thu May 30, 2019 9:21 pm

Nathan wrote:
Waewick wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 5:25 pm
PeFe wrote:My quick costing : car v public transport in Adelaide.

Car : new car every 5 years at average cost of $25,000 per car = $5000 per year.........$1000 rego/insurance......$60 per week on petrol = $3120
repairs/maintenance $2000........parking $200

Total for car : $11,320

Public transport : 12 times $99, 28 day Metrocard pass = $1,188

Total for public transport : $1,188
Thats if you just buy a car for driving to work (which people may).

A ticket on the bus for me is 3.60 so $7.20 for the day.

I can get early bird for $13. That becomes the daily thought.
That's still $5.80 more per day, which assuming full time 48wks a year, makes a $1,392 difference per year.
Agree but $5 is something people can dismiss if they need to pick kids from school or work late when the bus becomes less frequent.

Its not a simple fix and the $ amount isn't always the answer in Adelaide when parking is still relatively cheap.

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1787 Post by SBD » Thu May 30, 2019 10:55 pm

ChillyPhilly wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 12:56 pm
I'm not against distance-based pricing for fares.

I will raise this as a discussion point. Is it fair, however, for those living in Gawler or Seaford to pay more than someone living in Kilburn or Park Holme? Why should they be paying more just because they live further?

The single price Metrocard fare is the fairest way of charging for public transport. Perhaps the differences between e.g. Gawler and Kilburn should be marginal.
Those living in Gawler or Seaford have either decided that they accept the time, cost and effort of getting to the city each day, or they arrange their lives so that they don't need to do that. Perhaps they work and school their kids in Gawler, or Edinburgh/Elizabeth/Salisbury or the Barossa Valley or mid north (or McLaren Vale/Fleurieu Peninsula/Tonsley at the other end).

Is it fair that a kid from Gawler studying at St Patrick's Technical College in Elizabeth has to buy a ticket to Seaford (or even to Adelaide) if they use the train to get to school? Should your Kilburn resident expect to pay the same fare regardless of whether they work in Gawler, Adelaide or Seaford? Is Mount Barker now the same fare as well? Should Murray Bridge and Nuriootpa also be the same fare? What about Port Pirie and Bordertown?

As far as I know, country fares have "always" been different for each town, and I think also for the end point, not assuming every passenger would go to the end of the route. Urban fares in Adelaide used to have three price points, now two, and soon to be one fare for the entire metro area, which seems to keep growing with urban sprawl. I'm pretty sure I've been charged for the distance I actually travelled in other cities in Australia and overseas.

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1788 Post by Llessur2002 » Fri May 31, 2019 9:05 am

PeFe wrote:
Thu May 30, 2019 4:56 pm
My quick costing : car v public transport in Adelaide.

Car : new car every 5 years at average cost of $25,000 per car = $5000 per year.........$1000 rego/insurance......$60 per week on petrol = $3120
repairs/maintenance $2000........parking $200

Total for car : $11,320

Public transport : 12 times $99, 28 day Metrocard pass = $1,188

Total for public transport : $1,188
Don't forget to factor in the resale value of the car. A $25k car will still be worth $10-15k in 5 years time so the annual cost will be reduced by $2-3k. Still a big difference though.

We have a car but both my wife and I commute by train so we really only use it on weekends, and even then probably only 2 or 3 weekends out of 4. Shocking really to think something that costs us a significant % of one of our annual salaries just sits there doing nothing for five days per week.

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1789 Post by PeFe » Mon Jun 03, 2019 4:37 am

New fares for Metrocard/Ticket
Fare Changes 2019
When: From Sunday 7 July 2019

From Sunday, 7 July 2019 new fares will apply for all Adelaide Metro bus, train and tram services:

In line with previous years, fares will increase by approximately 2%.
The one-off purchase fee for MetroCARDs will be re-introduced, which will cover new, lost or damaged cards.
2-Section fares will no longer be offered, with options for passengers now including 28-day and 14-day passes, as well as regular, concession, student or senior fares.

Great travel options
Passengers are reminded that the 28-Day pass and 14-Day pass continue to provide great value-for-money travel options on all bus, train and tram services.

On weekends, school holidays and South Australian public holidays, two children under 15 years of age can travel free when accompanied by an adult using a Daytrip Metroticket.

South Australian Seniors Card holders can also travel free on all Adelaide Metro public transport services at the following times: Monday to Friday, Midnight to 7.00am, 9.01am to 3.00pm, 7.01pm to Midnight. All day Saturday, Sunday and public holidays. At all other times a concession fare is required.


New fare prices
New regular metroCARD • $5.00 (with a minimum recharge of $5.00 required).
New concession and student metroCARD • $3.50 (with a minimum recharge of $5.00 required).

Fare Type Singletrip (Peak) Singletrip (Interpeak) Daytrip
Weekdays before 9.01am and after 3pm. All Day Saturday Weekdays between 9.01am and 3pm. All day Sunday and SA public holidays Valid from first validation until 4.30am the following day
Regular
metroCARD $3.77 $2.07 -
metroticket $5.60 $3.70 $10.60
Concession and tertiary student
metroCARD $1.87 $1.00 -
metroticket $2.90 $1.40 $5.30
Primary and secondary student
metroCARD $1.26 $1.00 -
metroticket $2.80 $1.40 $5.30
Seniors Card holders*
Seniors card $1.87 FREE -
* South Australian Seniors Card holders travel free on all Adelaide Metro public transport services at the following times: Monday to Friday, Midnight to 7.00am, 9.01am to 3.00pm, 7.01pm to Midnight. All day Saturday, Sunday and public holidays. At all other times a concession fare is required.


metroCARD 28 Day Pass
Regular $101.00
Concession and tertiary student $50.00
Primary and secondary student $25.50

metroCARD 14 Day Pass
Regular $61.00
Concession and tertiary student $30.00
Primary and secondary student $15.50

https://adelaidemetro.com.au/Announceme ... anges-2019

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1790 Post by PeFe » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:41 am

ABC article on the up coming state budget relating to public transport.
Nothing new, but a good overview of current issues and plans.
Adelaide's public transport network to receive 'good news' in State Budget, Minister says
ABC Radio Adelaide By Malcolm Sutton

Image

There will be "good news" for public transport in Tuesday's State Budget, SA Transport Minister Stephan Knoll has said, despite some stakeholders fearing a reduction in services.

Mr Knoll admitted there was an "existing saving task, and we'll need to deal with that", but pointed out the cutback had been revealed in last year's budget.

"We aren't going to see any decreases in train or tram frequency and we've already done what we were going to do to the buses," he said.

"In fact, there's good news when it comes to public transport in the budget."

Mr Knoll did not reveal what the good news was but said another extension of the O-Bahn, this time to Golden Grove, was on the Government's public transport agenda, along with more Park'n'Ride services.

On Saturday he announced $8 million would be committed in the budget towards a replacement of the Tonsley train station — to be closed as part of the Flinders Link project — although consultation on its exact location will continue.

There was also some hope for those wanting more trams in Adelaide, namely a city tram loop and a potential extension to O'Connell Street in North Adelaide.

City loop on the radar
Ahead of losing Government last year, the Labor Party installed an East End tramline as a precursor to a city loop or an extension to Norwood.

It also installed a short and near-pointless spur north up King William Road in a less than subtle move to encourage further investment.

"There are 10 projects that we said we would be undertaking a business case development into, and one of those was a city tram loop," Mr Knoll said.

"In fact, we'll have a little bit more to say about that, not as part of the budget, but as something else we're doing in the next couple of weeks," he said.

But Mr Knoll said a wider network proposed for Greater Adelaide, including extending the tram to Norwood, or lines to Prospect and up Unley Road, would not be happening on his watch.

"When we look at making future investments in public transport, we need to look into the future," he said.

"I don't think in five to 10 years time we're going to be building light rail networks.

"There is a whole host of new technology that is coming down the pipe very quickly and whether that be electric buses, some sort of autonomous version, hydrogen buses, as well as trackless trams, it's going to provide better solutions for public transport."

Feeder network priority
The Government in last year's budget planned savings of up to $15 million by rationalising low patronised bus services, reducing duplication and optimising timetables.

In May, Mr Knoll announced the planned cessation of bus contracts by June 30 — a date later extended to the second quarter of 2020 — and put out tenders for new bus services to direct people onto city-bound trains and trams in a "feeder" service.

He also announced a $1 million trial for Uber-style, bus-on-demand services in low-patronage areas — a move Opposition transport spokesperson Tom Koutsantonis said at the time would help the Government cut a planned "$46 million" from the budget.

People for Public Transport (PPT) president Josephine Buckhorn was concerned some services were going to be cancelled because "on paper they look like they're not frequently used".

She wanted the Transport Minister to meet with stakeholders and organisations like the PPT before making decisions about existing routes.

"Given a prediction they're going to be cutting, from what I understand, around $40 million from public transport, we are certainly worried about what's going to happen," Ms Buckhorn said.

"I understand they need to cut the budget but I think they need to exercise more caution because the impact of cutting a service and have it disappear can be disastrous.

"It's extremely difficult to reinstate."

Ms Buckhorn said the on-demand trial should run alongside other options, such as utilising smaller buses.

Mr Knoll said that as part of the bus tender process currently underway, he had asked companies to suggest ideas for better feeder technology, believing such integration was "key" to increasing patronage across the network.

Support for connecting services
Doctor Sekhar Somenahalli, from the University of South Australia's School of Natural and Built Environments, agreed that interchanges played a vital role in urban public transport systems.
He said connecting them with a "high-quality and high-frequency" service should be priority.

"As per our recent study, a significant number, 40 per cent, of respondents surveyed were willing to use public transport at interchanges if they were well connected by shuttles," Dr Somenahalli said.

He said figures from his own research found a "spatial mismatch" between the bus feeder network and the location of Park'n'Ride users at the Paradise bus interchange.

"Only 37 per cent are within 400 metres, walkable areas, of the existing bus feeder service," Dr Somenahalli said.
This highlights the need for improving the feeder coverage appropriately to reduce the car parking demand at the interchanges.

"Here an on-demand bus system could be trialled."

Doctor Somenahalli believed investment in a tram network should be a top priority as well, along with extending the O-Bahn, and giving buses priority on roads while supporting city cycling and walking networks.

Recouping costs with fare changes
The 2018 budget also forecast reduced public transport fares, but Mr Knoll has since abolished two-section tickets on trains and trams from July 1.

This means people travelling small distances on a single ticket will have to pay a full fare of $5.50 instead of $3.50, or $2 instead of $3.70 if they are using a tap-on metrocard.

Mr Knoll, however, maintains frequent users will only be marginally worse off — about $150 a year — if they purchase 14-day or 28-day passes, suggesting that a very small fraction of people bought two-section passes.

"It's a tough call; we don't shy away from that," he said.

"For those people who are regular public transport users, it shouldn't be a huge increase.

"If you're a casual public transport user, then by definition it will only affect you for those times you use it."

The 2018-2019 State Budget will be handed down on Tuesday.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-17/ ... t/11207076

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1791 Post by Nathan » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:44 am

"I don't think in five to 10 years time we're going to be building light rail networks.

"There is a whole host of new technology that is coming down the pipe very quickly and whether that be electric buses, some sort of autonomous version, hydrogen buses, as well as trackless trams, it's going to provide better solutions for public transport."
Sigh...

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1792 Post by muzzamo » Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:51 am

DPTI have gone very quiet on the tram/train station / overpass at goodwood station.

With any luck doing something sensible there is one of the projects that they are considering a business case for. The train/tram connectivity there is ridiculous and the station is old. Yes it's close to the newly build Showgrounds station but the case is there for improving it. Southern suburbs and hills train commuters could change to the tram to gain access to the southern part of the CBD and Glenelg.

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1793 Post by Westside » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:03 pm

One thing confused me, the article states that two section tickets will no longer be available for trains and trams, presumably assuming they will still be available for buses? If this is the case, then that's actually not too horrible. We should leave high-capacity, rapid transit for longer journeys. The problem about Adelaide's rail system is that nothing about it is high-capacity or rapid!
Mr Knoll said that as part of the bus tender process currently underway, he had asked companies to suggest ideas for better feeder technology, believing such integration was "key" to increasing patronage across the network.
This is positive. Given that most passengers can see when a train or bus is about to arrive, surely they can be fitted with the same so a driver is able to make a determination whether it should wait an extra minute before departing. This would greatly improve connections.

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1794 Post by PeFe » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:08 pm

2 section tickets are being axed for all modes

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1795 Post by gnrc_louis » Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:59 pm

Nathan wrote:
Mon Jun 17, 2019 11:44 am
"I don't think in five to 10 years time we're going to be building light rail networks.

"There is a whole host of new technology that is coming down the pipe very quickly and whether that be electric buses, some sort of autonomous version, hydrogen buses, as well as trackless trams, it's going to provide better solutions for public transport."
Sigh...
Don't worry, by then everyone will ride e-scooters, ubers and "trackless trams" everywhere :roll:

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1796 Post by SRW » Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:45 pm

Adelaide's public transport going back to the future under Stephan Knoll
Malcom Sutton, 21 June 2019, ABC News
Image
Road investment trumps light rail when it comes to Adelaide's public transport future, according to Transport Minister Stephan Knoll, a position reiterated by the details in this week's SA budget.

Despite billions being earmarked for metropolitan roads, no new money was allocated to pursue a long-awaited city tram loop, and works on the Port Dock, a one-kilometre railway spur to Port Adelaide and bus interchange, was put on hold.

Mr Knoll said the Government was taking a "technology-neutral" approach to public transport and roads investment, making it clear that he did not believe light rail would survive technological advancements.

"Most of the technologies that are coming down the pipeline will use a road corridor," he said, citing electric and hydrogen buses along with autonomous technology.

"Even the ability of trackless trams to use part of an exiting road corridor is quite high, so while the technology is sorting itself out, we want to continue to invest in the road network.

"I genuinely don't think that this sort of heavy track, overhead lines, track-in-the-ground sort of dedicated light rail corridor is the best answer about how we do public transport into the future."

The former Labor government was keen on passenger rail investment and planned an ambitious project to bring trams back to the metropolitan district — 60 years after one of the most extensive networks in Australia was ripped up (with the exception of one line) to make way for buses.

It was partly inspired by similar investments made across Europe, notably in Bordeaux, France, which ripped up its tramline about the same time as Adelaide and other cities to make way for cars and buses.

Port Dock disappointment

Mr Knoll said the Port Dock had been put on hold because scoping works by the Public Transport Projects Alliance found it would cost $40 million, not the $16.4 million budgeted by Labor before it lost power.

This is despite a public meeting held by the Government in March about the stages of upcoming works and several businesses establishing themselves in the district in anticipation of a new bus interchange and railway station.

"A good idea at $16 million isn't necessarily a good idea at $40 million," Mr Knoll said.

"If I think about what we could do with $40 million to improve public transport in the north-west, there is more than just building a rail spur as an option.

"That's why we have announced straight away a tender to look at a proper planning study in the north-west."

Labor Member for Port Adelaide Susan Close said the backflip had been "absolutely devastating" for the community.

"For the residents, but particularly for the businesses that have invested huge amounts of money ready for this spur," she said.

"You had Pirate Life Brewing company which had set up a big beer garden and distribution precinct right next to where that rail station was supposed to be."

Port Adelaide Guide spokeswoman Amanda McKinnon said the railway station cancellation was a "big disappointment".

"We've had so many new businesses coming in just knowing this was happening and there's a lot of devastated people around Port Adelaide."

City of Port Adelaide Enfield Mayor Claire Boan said the spur was part of an economic plan to bring people, namely tourists, into the Port.

"We've had so many other small developers coming into the area, making it look awesome and putting their heart and soul into this, knowing this spur line and bus interchange was coming."

Railways drive investment confidence

Thanasis Avramis, the former president of People for Public Transport, said the benefit of rail projects were the value-added components driving adjacent housing and business development.

"As experienced overseas, once a fixed tramline goes down, people have the confidence there's going to be a public transport route there on a long-term basis," he said.

"The trouble with buses and, for that matter, the idea of trackless trams, is that by the will of the government of the day, the bus route disappears."

Mr Knoll said the Glenelg to Entertainment Centre tramline extension through Adelaide had been "fantastic", but light rail was not the only infrastructure that drove investment growth.

"If you think about investment in corridors as a result of infrastructure investment in South Australia, the biggest example we've seen has been after-road investment," he said.

"After the Heysen Tunnels were built, there was massive investment out at Mount Barker, and housing developments and housing value [increased] all along the South-Eastern Freeway.

"The same can be said of the Northern Expressway, where we've seen huge investments in regional towns around Roseworthy, Gawler, Feeling, Nuriootpa, and once the Northern Connector is finished, I would suggest places like Two Wells and Buckland Park are going to do a lot."

Little new money for public transport

Tuesday's budget allocated $733.5 million of state and Commonwealth funding over four years for metropolitan road congestion mitigation and level crossing upgrades, including grade separations at Torrens Road in Ovingham and at Brighton Road in Hove.

It also outlined a further $3 billion towards completing the north-south corridor, and $1.1 billion over eight years for regional road projects and infrastructure upgrades.

Public transport, however, received just $8 million in new money for a Tonsley rail station replacement as part of the ongoing $125 million Flinders Link project, and $2.7 million to restore an Adelaide Railway Station exterior facade as part of the Sky City Casino development.

The total cost of the City South Tramline upgrade also increased from $7.93 million flagged in last year's budget to a total of $17.5 million.

The ongoing $615 million Gawler line electrification project — bolstered last year with $137.9 million from the Commonwealth — will continue.

Mr Knoll said the good news was passenger fares had been "quarantined" from the "broader fees and charges increases that happened" across other government services.

This has been overshadowed, however, by his move to abolish the two-section ticket from July 1, a move that will create fare increases of up to $2 per trip for passengers who will no longer be able to travel up to three kilometres at a reduced price.

Delays for new trams and trains

Interstate, Sydney has been making significant light rail investments with a 12-kilometre route under construction, as has Canberra, which completed its Gungahlin to City line this year and is planning extensions and a network expansion.

Each of their respective governments believe light rail will be critical to support population growth over coming decades and reduce car numbers in the CBD.

But the SA Liberals made it clear prior to its election that a new tram network would not be built under its watch, with the exception, perhaps, of a city tram loop that incorporated North Adelaide.

Mr Knoll said the city tram loop was still being "explored" and in about two weeks' time the Government would "have more to say about how we're going to do that, in terms of the business case".

"The former government just decided to do infrastructure projects, but what we're keen to do is the planning work behind it, actually check out if it's a good idea or not."

He said a planning study was also underway into an O-Bahn extension to Golden Grove in the city's north, which would be completed "very soon".
I've actually had good deal of respect for Knoll, because even though I don't agree with him, he's at least attempted to engage with questions and provide a rationale for his approach. But the above article reveals the BS. He uses 'technology-neutral' describe his point of view with the same degree of obfuscation that Malcom Turnbull did when ruining the NBN; what they're really doing is attempting to mask the ideology driven nature of their policy (in)decision. He thinks roads are an indisputably Good Thing, evidence be damned. I mean, ffs, if his idea of a good return on investment is urban sprawl at Mount Barker*, in the Barossa and potentially goddamn Buckland Park, then the article headline is on the right track - he really is stuck in the past.

And I don't know why he continues to tease about a city loop/North Adelaide tram extension; if they were gonna do it, it would've been in the budget. Not to mention, his increasing antipathy towards passenger rail is beginning to preclude such an outcome.

*(To clarify, the Heysen Tunnels and Northern Connector are good investments, but not because of the sprawl)
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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1797 Post by Nathan » Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:52 pm

We're "technology neutral", except cars are totally the best.

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1798 Post by Bob » Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:04 pm

SRW wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:45 pm
Adelaide's public transport going back to the future under Stephan Knoll
Malcom Sutton, 21 June 2019, ABC News
Image
Road investment trumps light rail when it comes to Adelaide's public transport future, according to Transport Minister Stephan Knoll, a position reiterated by the details in this week's SA budget.

Despite billions being earmarked for metropolitan roads, no new money was allocated to pursue a long-awaited city tram loop, and works on the Port Dock, a one-kilometre railway spur to Port Adelaide and bus interchange, was put on hold.

Mr Knoll said the Government was taking a "technology-neutral" approach to public transport and roads investment, making it clear that he did not believe light rail would survive technological advancements.

"Most of the technologies that are coming down the pipeline will use a road corridor," he said, citing electric and hydrogen buses along with autonomous technology.

"Even the ability of trackless trams to use part of an exiting road corridor is quite high, so while the technology is sorting itself out, we want to continue to invest in the road network.

"I genuinely don't think that this sort of heavy track, overhead lines, track-in-the-ground sort of dedicated light rail corridor is the best answer about how we do public transport into the future."

The former Labor government was keen on passenger rail investment and planned an ambitious project to bring trams back to the metropolitan district — 60 years after one of the most extensive networks in Australia was ripped up (with the exception of one line) to make way for buses.

It was partly inspired by similar investments made across Europe, notably in Bordeaux, France, which ripped up its tramline about the same time as Adelaide and other cities to make way for cars and buses.

Port Dock disappointment

Mr Knoll said the Port Dock had been put on hold because scoping works by the Public Transport Projects Alliance found it would cost $40 million, not the $16.4 million budgeted by Labor before it lost power.

This is despite a public meeting held by the Government in March about the stages of upcoming works and several businesses establishing themselves in the district in anticipation of a new bus interchange and railway station.

"A good idea at $16 million isn't necessarily a good idea at $40 million," Mr Knoll said.

"If I think about what we could do with $40 million to improve public transport in the north-west, there is more than just building a rail spur as an option.

"That's why we have announced straight away a tender to look at a proper planning study in the north-west."

Labor Member for Port Adelaide Susan Close said the backflip had been "absolutely devastating" for the community.

"For the residents, but particularly for the businesses that have invested huge amounts of money ready for this spur," she said.

"You had Pirate Life Brewing company which had set up a big beer garden and distribution precinct right next to where that rail station was supposed to be."

Port Adelaide Guide spokeswoman Amanda McKinnon said the railway station cancellation was a "big disappointment".

"We've had so many new businesses coming in just knowing this was happening and there's a lot of devastated people around Port Adelaide."

City of Port Adelaide Enfield Mayor Claire Boan said the spur was part of an economic plan to bring people, namely tourists, into the Port.

"We've had so many other small developers coming into the area, making it look awesome and putting their heart and soul into this, knowing this spur line and bus interchange was coming."

Railways drive investment confidence

Thanasis Avramis, the former president of People for Public Transport, said the benefit of rail projects were the value-added components driving adjacent housing and business development.

"As experienced overseas, once a fixed tramline goes down, people have the confidence there's going to be a public transport route there on a long-term basis," he said.

"The trouble with buses and, for that matter, the idea of trackless trams, is that by the will of the government of the day, the bus route disappears."

Mr Knoll said the Glenelg to Entertainment Centre tramline extension through Adelaide had been "fantastic", but light rail was not the only infrastructure that drove investment growth.

"If you think about investment in corridors as a result of infrastructure investment in South Australia, the biggest example we've seen has been after-road investment," he said.

"After the Heysen Tunnels were built, there was massive investment out at Mount Barker, and housing developments and housing value [increased] all along the South-Eastern Freeway.

"The same can be said of the Northern Expressway, where we've seen huge investments in regional towns around Roseworthy, Gawler, Feeling, Nuriootpa, and once the Northern Connector is finished, I would suggest places like Two Wells and Buckland Park are going to do a lot."

Little new money for public transport

Tuesday's budget allocated $733.5 million of state and Commonwealth funding over four years for metropolitan road congestion mitigation and level crossing upgrades, including grade separations at Torrens Road in Ovingham and at Brighton Road in Hove.

It also outlined a further $3 billion towards completing the north-south corridor, and $1.1 billion over eight years for regional road projects and infrastructure upgrades.

Public transport, however, received just $8 million in new money for a Tonsley rail station replacement as part of the ongoing $125 million Flinders Link project, and $2.7 million to restore an Adelaide Railway Station exterior facade as part of the Sky City Casino development.

The total cost of the City South Tramline upgrade also increased from $7.93 million flagged in last year's budget to a total of $17.5 million.

The ongoing $615 million Gawler line electrification project — bolstered last year with $137.9 million from the Commonwealth — will continue.

Mr Knoll said the good news was passenger fares had been "quarantined" from the "broader fees and charges increases that happened" across other government services.

This has been overshadowed, however, by his move to abolish the two-section ticket from July 1, a move that will create fare increases of up to $2 per trip for passengers who will no longer be able to travel up to three kilometres at a reduced price.

Delays for new trams and trains

Interstate, Sydney has been making significant light rail investments with a 12-kilometre route under construction, as has Canberra, which completed its Gungahlin to City line this year and is planning extensions and a network expansion.

Each of their respective governments believe light rail will be critical to support population growth over coming decades and reduce car numbers in the CBD.

But the SA Liberals made it clear prior to its election that a new tram network would not be built under its watch, with the exception, perhaps, of a city tram loop that incorporated North Adelaide.

Mr Knoll said the city tram loop was still being "explored" and in about two weeks' time the Government would "have more to say about how we're going to do that, in terms of the business case".

"The former government just decided to do infrastructure projects, but what we're keen to do is the planning work behind it, actually check out if it's a good idea or not."

He said a planning study was also underway into an O-Bahn extension to Golden Grove in the city's north, which would be completed "very soon".
I've actually had good deal of respect for Knoll, because even though I don't agree with him, he's at least attempted to engage with questions and provide a rationale for his approach. But the above article reveals the BS. He uses 'technology-neutral' describe his point of view with the same degree of obfuscation that Malcom Turnbull did when ruining the NBN; what they're really doing is attempting to mask the ideology driven nature of their policy (in)decision. He thinks roads are an indisputably Good Thing, evidence be damned. I mean, ffs, if his idea of a good return on investment is urban sprawl at Mount Barker*, in the Barossa and potentially goddamn Buckland Park, then the article headline is on the right track - he really is stuck in the past.

And I don't know why he continues to tease about a city loop/North Adelaide tram extension; if they were gonna do it, it would've been in the budget. Not to mention, his increasing antipathy towards passenger rail is beginning to preclude such an outcome.

*(To clarify, the Heysen Tunnels and Northern Connector are good investments, but not because of the sprawl)
As I posted the other month on the Trams forum on this site, I speculated a tram extension statement of some sort by the end of this year.

Even against all the odds and all the anti-PT noise coming out pre & post budget from this Govt, I still expect something. Although the statement / announcement might be sooner than I originally thought.

However, $$$ would need to be Federal funded, that could only happen in a realistic timeframe if Adelaide bids & wins the 2026 Commonwealth Games.

I suspect the teasing is about the CW games bid and all that goes with it. He certainly has something up his sleeve, he’s almost getting cocky recently.

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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1799 Post by SRW » Sat Jun 22, 2019 5:21 pm

Bob wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:04 pm
As I posted the other month on the Trams forum on this site, I speculated a tram extension statement of some sort by the end of this year.

Even against all the odds and all the anti-PT noise coming out pre & post budget from this Govt, I still expect something. Although the statement / announcement might be sooner than I originally thought.

However, $$$ would need to be Federal funded, that could only happen in a realistic timeframe if Adelaide bids & wins the 2026 Commonwealth Games.

I suspect the teasing is about the CW games bid and all that goes with it. He certainly has something up his sleeve, he’s almost getting cocky recently.
Ah yes the games. Good point, I hadn't factored that. The study for the games should indeed be complete and ready to announce, so that'd tie in well with the 'something big to say in a few weeks' narrative Knoll has been pushing. It's probably the only circumstance under which I can see the tram happening, and likely only with a nice sum thrown in from the feds. In which case, we might expect announcements of more than just trams, and this government will finally have vision after 18 months of doing nothing. Fingers crossed, for SA's sake.

EDIT: Another thought, added to the Commonwealth Games tie in for the tram may be 88 O'Connell (preferred developer due to be announced soon) and Crows HQ, finally providing enough headline benefit for the government to support the extension.
Last edited by SRW on Sat Jun 22, 2019 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: News & Discussion: Public Transport Service & Policy

#1800 Post by rubberman » Sat Jun 22, 2019 8:15 pm

Nathan wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:52 pm
We're "technology neutral", except cars are totally the best.
Well, that's what the numbers are showing. I have bored people to death previously saying that high cost for tram projects will kill them. And here we are, high costs for tram projects are giving the government a reason to kill them.

Want to kill the North Adelaide extension? Spend tens of millions strengthening a bridge designed to carry H cars coupled.

Look at the new tram stop and relay at $17m. You could build 35 houses for that, each of which would require foundations needed to carry a house. Ask yourself whether the materials and intricacy of work are more to build a house or a slab of track and a tram stop.

I cannot fault the Minister for making a decision that tram costs are so high that it's not worth it compared to cars.

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