[U/C] M2 North-South Motorway

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4171 Post by bits » Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:43 pm

Maybe DPTI is quietly buying as much land as people will just give up on the east side in preparation for an official announcement where compulsory acquisitions will begin.

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4172 Post by claybro » Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:32 pm

It's not just the N/s corridor. Those plans and required land reserves should have been well established by now. What is also missing is any cohesive plan to link the N/S to the SE freeway- just a vague indication it will follow the cross road alignment. This piece by piece approach creates extra expense, angst and politicking as the inevitable choke point arrives ( see the unnessesary flagulation over the Thebarton Theatre). Ts just dumb. It also means SA continues to miss additional federal funding. The Libs really surprise me here. By all means we expected them to drop the ball on PT.. but their approach to roads has been extremely underwhealming and that is supposedly their strong point.

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4173 Post by rev » Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:44 pm

claybro wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:32 pm
It's not just the N/s corridor. Those plans and required land reserves should have been well established by now. What is also missing is any cohesive plan to link the N/S to the SE freeway- just a vague indication it will follow the cross road alignment. This piece by piece approach creates extra expense, angst and politicking as the inevitable choke point arrives ( see the unnessesary flagulation over the Thebarton Theatre). Ts just dumb. It also means SA continues to miss additional federal funding. The Libs really surprise me here. By all means we expected them to drop the ball on PT.. but their approach to roads has been extremely underwhealming and that is supposedly their strong point.
That's the problem in SA..they are making it up as they go along, stage by stage. And the clowns sitting in parliament are talking about tunnels...HAAAAAAAAAAAH..

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4174 Post by Mr Smith » Thu Nov 21, 2019 5:59 pm

That's the problem in SA..they are making it up as they go along, stage by stage. And the clowns sitting in parliament are talking about tunnels...HAAAAAAAAAAAH..
[/quote]

Yeah totally agree. The ALP plan was fine. A couple of short tunnels under Bradman and HB Road. Why pursue this fantasy of a tunnel(s) spanning the entire length of the remaining stretch, or even a fair extent of it. Lowered worked fine along T2T, and between Edwardstown and Tonsley there are few if any houses, its basically light industry, warehouses and shops, so elevated, or at grade seems a suitable solution.

As someone else speculated, this whole tunnel scenario seems like a good excuse for more studies and dithering, IE keep kicking the can down the road. And meanwhile Adelaide's busiest and most important road artery is a car park. JOKE.

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4175 Post by aceman » Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:26 pm

the 'we're looking at tunnel options' is just another token line to keep the masses at bay a little longer while they work out what to say next. I'd rather they just be honest and say sorry there are no future plans because it's too expensive and we can't afford it so the section between tonsley and the torrens will remain as it is for the foreseeable future. I was putting petrol in my car at the caltex at castle plaza and noticed what looks like another petrol station going up directly across the road. it's business as usual all along that section. it's almost as if the whole plan doesn't even exist.

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4176 Post by RiseHigh » Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:59 pm

That’s right why are they building a new petrol station so close to south road on the eastern side, is it because there is no plan to do anything for years?

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4177 Post by aceman » Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:56 pm

pretty much, the hardest section to do has just been shelved. it's all political spin and speculation

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4178 Post by Vasco » Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:59 pm

Just in time..

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4179 Post by aceman » Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:10 pm

more spin from the advertiser nothing new

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4180 Post by ChillyPhilly » Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:17 pm

The only concrete progress - of any form - made on the next section of the project is the vague announcement by Knoll a while back about a review of compulsory acquisition laws.

This is probably the reservation behind plans not being made in detail then subsequently also not being released to the public. It can lead to manipulation of real estate values.

Scenario: 'My house at 1069 South Road in Edwardstown might cost $465,000 at market value. Oh, what? Thanks for telling me the secret plan about me and my neighbours' homes being bought up by the government! I'll do some cheap renos and ask for triple now!'
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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4181 Post by aceman » Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:32 am

ChillyPhilly wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:17 pm
The only concrete progress - of any form - made on the next section of the project is the vague announcement by Knoll a while back about a review of compulsory acquisition laws.

This is probably the reservation behind plans not being made in detail then subsequently also not being released to the public. It can lead to manipulation of real estate values.

Scenario: 'My house at 1069 South Road in Edwardstown might cost $465,000 at market value. Oh, what? Thanks for telling me the secret plan about me and my neighbours' homes being bought up by the government! I'll do some cheap renos and ask for triple now!'
fair point, but what about the scenario in my earlier post about what looks like a brand new petrol station going up directly opposite castle plaza? they demoed an older building then start on building a brand new facility. what would have been an empty block after demo is now a fully fledged petrol station that will have to be acquired then demolished. it's a never ending cycle that repeats itself.

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4182 Post by SBD » Fri Nov 22, 2019 9:13 am

aceman wrote:
Fri Nov 22, 2019 8:32 am
ChillyPhilly wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:17 pm
The only concrete progress - of any form - made on the next section of the project is the vague announcement by Knoll a while back about a review of compulsory acquisition laws.

This is probably the reservation behind plans not being made in detail then subsequently also not being released to the public. It can lead to manipulation of real estate values.

Scenario: 'My house at 1069 South Road in Edwardstown might cost $465,000 at market value. Oh, what? Thanks for telling me the secret plan about me and my neighbours' homes being bought up by the government! I'll do some cheap renos and ask for triple now!'
fair point, but what about the scenario in my earlier post about what looks like a brand new petrol station going up directly opposite castle plaza? they demoed an older building then start on building a brand new facility. what would have been an empty block after demo is now a fully fledged petrol station that will have to be acquired then demolished. it's a never ending cycle that repeats itself.
I doubt there is ever a single "ideal solution". Limiting development because "we might be going to acquire and demolish it some time in the future" would require some kind of easement, likely with an annual fee. Being a priority customer for land as it comes up for sale leads to the government becoming landlord, or custodian of increasing patches of derelict buildings or vacant land. If the landlord option is chosen, the government becomes the "bad guy" when renovation is declined. If the renovations are performed, then it's the government that gets bagged for eventually demolishing its recently-upgraded buildings. It still costs later to move the business or residents. If the buildings are demolished before the full road development occurs, we get an increasingly barren landscape, and the remaining properties' values decline because of it.

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4183 Post by bits » Fri Nov 22, 2019 9:25 am

The government is not yet compulsory acquiring land required for the road upgrade. Land owners will continue business as usual and even some may game the system be developing property knowing there is a high chance it may get purchased soon.

The government likely wants to obtain as much land as possible prior to announcing a plan and turning to compulsory acquisition.
It also needs the funding to purchase all the property.
A handful of properties developed out of 15km of property is surely the lesser problem.

I would say next section is Torrens to Anzac highway also.

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4184 Post by how good is he » Fri Nov 22, 2019 9:29 am

Ok based on these hypothetical options -

A) Tunnels -10 years & $10 billion (and possibly tolls?)
Vs
B) Trench - 7 years & $7 billion but vastly more property & business resumptions & loss of heritage and far more disruption while being built.
Vs
C) Hybrid. A combination of the above.
8.5 years and $8.5 billion.

What is your decision and/or the likely decision by the Govt?

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[U/C] Re: North-South Motorway

#4185 Post by rev » Fri Nov 22, 2019 11:00 am

SBD wrote:
Fri Nov 22, 2019 9:13 am
I doubt there is ever a single "ideal solution". Limiting development because "we might be going to acquire and demolish it some time in the future" would require some kind of easement, likely with an annual fee. Being a priority customer for land as it comes up for sale leads to the government becoming landlord, or custodian of increasing patches of derelict buildings or vacant land. If the landlord option is chosen, the government becomes the "bad guy" when renovation is declined. If the renovations are performed, then it's the government that gets bagged for eventually demolishing its recently-upgraded buildings. It still costs later to move the business or residents. If the buildings are demolished before the full road development occurs, we get an increasingly barren landscape, and the remaining properties' values decline because of it.
Well quite obviously, that's where planning comes in to play.

Besides, everybody knows south road is going to be extensively upgraded within the next 10~ years.
As a business owner, why would you choose to setup shop on south road, knowing that within 2-3 years, the property will probably be acquired? And if it's not acquired, you will likely face significant delays and issues with construction work?

It's a shit situation. South road is our busiest corridor, so obviously as a business owner you would want to be located there or nearby as that provides huge exposure for your business.
But the uncertainty that exists of how long your business will be there before the government sends in bulldozers is bullshit. It's created by the lack of planning and the lack of a real vision and foresight by our governments. Our politicians have a lot to answer for, sadly nobody in this state really gives a shit about most things, they only spark up when there's some global or national activism going on that gets their attention either positively or negatively. The rest of the time they are more apathetic then a stunned mullet.

If they had their act together, lets be honest, we would at the very least know exactly what was going to be done with the remaining stretch.

When is the next state election again? :toilet:

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