[COM] Goodwood Junction Rail Underpass | $110m

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[COM] Goodwood Junction Rail Underpass | $110m

#1 Post by AtD » Thu May 26, 2011 10:11 am

http://weekly-times-messenger.whereiliv ... 8-million/
Bowden tunnel to cost $418 million
A ONE kilometre tunnel and train station beneath a Bowden housing development is set to cost taxpayers $418 million.

The State Government says the project will reduce traffic on Park Tce, improve train services and be a feature of its 2200-home Bowden Urban Village project.

A spokesman for Transport Minister Pat Conlon said the works had been costed at about $418 million and would need funding from the state and federal governments to go ahead.

Department of Trade, Energy and Infrastructure head Rod Hook said the project, which had no timeframe, would be programmed after “the Commonwealth comes to the party and puts their share on the table”.

Mr Hook said the tunnel would begin in the parklands about 500m southeast of Park Tce and travel under the freight line to reduce track and road congestion.

He said the tunnel would end immediately after Chief St and include an underground train station in the heart of the Bowden development.

“If we get the Commonwealth funds ... there’s no point in bringing the Outer Harbor line half way up to Park Tce,” Mr Hook said.

“You might as well take it under Park Tce to take the crossing out and if you’re going under Park Tce, you might as well stay down and build the Bowden Station underground.

“It takes the delays associated with the level crossing out.”

The State Government will develop the Bowden Urban Village, planned for the former Clipsal and Origin Energy sites between Chief St and Park Tce, over the next 10-12 years, with shops, offices and 2400 homes.

It is the first of 14 transit oriented developments (TODs) planned across Adelaide, with some residents expected to move in by early 2013.

The $418 million pricetag on the works dwarfs the $264 million the government plans to spend on the TOD over the next decade. Mr Hook said tunnelling the passenger line through the 16 ha site would improve the development’s appearance.

He said separating the passenger and freight lines was already on Infrastructure Australia’s National Priority List of future projects.

“It becomes entirely a matter for the Commonwealth Government as to the timing,” Mr Hook said.

A spokesman for Federal Infrastructure Minister Anthony Albanese did not shed any light on when the project was likely to be funded.

“The Government has consistently said that when additional infrastructure funding becomes available in future budgets, the National Priority List will help guide our investment decisions,” he said.

Mr Conlon’s spokesman said works at the Bowden Urban Village could proceed for about five years before the trainline was put underground.

“In the unlikely event that no Federal funding is secured in that timeframe, the LMC (Land Management Corporation) is confident they will be able to adjust the planning for future stages of the Bowden Urban Village,” the spokesman said.

WHAT YOU COULD DO WITH $418 MILLION

Fund council-run services at The Parks Community Centre for 174 years ($2.4 million)

Upgrade and electrify the Outer Harbor train line twice ($200m)

Build four State Aquatic Centres ($100m)

Reinstate Keith Hospital’s axed funding for 1152 years ($363,000 per year)

Build half a South Rd Superway ($812m)

Carry out 3/4 of a major overhaul to Adelaide Oval ($535m)

Extend the tramline from North Tce in the city to the Entertainment Centre, four times ($106.9 million)

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[COM] Re: Bowden Rail Tunnel

#2 Post by rhino » Thu May 26, 2011 10:27 am

Adelaide Now wrote: WHAT YOU COULD DO WITH $418 MILLION

Fund council-run services at The Parks Community Centre for 174 years ($2.4 million)

Upgrade and electrify the Outer Harbor train line twice ($200m)

Build four State Aquatic Centres ($100m)

Reinstate Keith Hospital’s axed funding for 1152 years ($363,000 per year)

Build half a South Rd Superway ($812m)

Carry out 3/4 of a major overhaul to Adelaide Oval ($535m)

Extend the tramline from North Tce in the city to the Entertainment Centre, four times ($106.9 million)
I really don't see the point of this crap on the end of the article. It's not as if anyone's going to want the money spent on a second electrification of an electric train route, or four more aquatic centres, or another half a superway, or another 3/4 Adelaide oval, or four more tramlines from the city to the EntCent. Just bloody pointless crap.

Having said that, the rail tunnel is a good idea IMO. I wonder what will happen with the tram?
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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#3 Post by Waewick » Thu May 26, 2011 11:32 am

well lets face it

why not just tunnel right through to Norwood :lol:

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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#4 Post by PeFe » Thu May 26, 2011 11:52 am

The tram continues along Port Rd and turns right into East St joining the train line (which resurfaces west of the Bowden station) creating a train/tram transport corridor.

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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#5 Post by rhino » Thu May 26, 2011 12:15 pm

PeFe wrote:The tram continues along Port Rd and turns right into East St joining the train line (which resurfaces west of the Bowden station) creating a train/tram transport corridor.
Messenger Press wrote:He said the tunnel would end immediately after Chief St and include an underground train station in the heart of the Bowden development.
I think the plan to go up East St may have changed.
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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#6 Post by Nathan » Thu May 26, 2011 12:39 pm

rhino wrote:
PeFe wrote:The tram continues along Port Rd and turns right into East St joining the train line (which resurfaces west of the Bowden station) creating a train/tram transport corridor.
Messenger Press wrote:He said the tunnel would end immediately after Chief St and include an underground train station in the heart of the Bowden development.
I think the plan to go up East St may have changed.
No, that's still in the masterplan, with a stop at the Gasworks park.

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[COM] Re: Bowden Rail Tunnel

#7 Post by spiller » Thu May 26, 2011 2:16 pm

rhino wrote:
Adelaide Now wrote: WHAT YOU COULD DO WITH $418 MILLION

Fund council-run services at The Parks Community Centre for 174 years ($2.4 million)

Upgrade and electrify the Outer Harbor train line twice ($200m)

Build four State Aquatic Centres ($100m)

Reinstate Keith Hospital’s axed funding for 1152 years ($363,000 per year)

Build half a South Rd Superway ($812m)

Carry out 3/4 of a major overhaul to Adelaide Oval ($535m)

Extend the tramline from North Tce in the city to the Entertainment Centre, four times ($106.9 million)
I really don't see the point of this crap on the end of the article. It's not as if anyone's going to want the money spent on a second electrification of an electric train route, or four more aquatic centres, or another half a superway, or another 3/4 Adelaide oval, or four more tramlines from the city to the EntCent. Just bloody pointless crap.

Having said that, the rail tunnel is a good idea IMO. I wonder what will happen with the tram?
it wouldn't be the advertiser without it :lol:

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[COM] Re: Bowden Rail Tunnel

#8 Post by Aidan » Thu May 26, 2011 2:35 pm

rhino wrote:
Adelaide Now wrote:
You're misattributing it - it's the Messenger, not Adelaide Now. Nor is it the 'Tiser, which hasn't reported it yet AFAIK.
WHAT YOU COULD DO WITH $418 MILLION

Fund council-run services at The Parks Community Centre for 174 years ($2.4 million)

Upgrade and electrify the Outer Harbor train line twice ($200m)

Build four State Aquatic Centres ($100m)

Reinstate Keith Hospital’s axed funding for 1152 years ($363,000 per year)

Build half a South Rd Superway ($812m)

Carry out 3/4 of a major overhaul to Adelaide Oval ($535m)

Extend the tramline from North Tce in the city to the Entertainment Centre, four times ($106.9 million)
I really don't see the point of this crap on the end of the article. It's not as if anyone's going to want the money spent on a second electrification of an electric train route, or four more aquatic centres, or another half a superway, or another 3/4 Adelaide oval, or four more tramlines from the city to the EntCent. Just bloody pointless crap.
The point seems clear to me: $418m is a lot of money, and we shouldn't waste it when much more worthwhile things in our state are cancelled due to lack of funding.

Some of the things on the list are badly phrased (anything that could be expressed in km should be) but the message is almost inescapable: though this is not the most expensive thing that could be done, it would require a lot of money that could be put to better use.
Having said that, the rail tunnel is a good idea IMO. I wonder what will happen with the tram?
There are many places in Adelaide where rail tunnels would be a good idea. IMO this isn't one of them because it would do absolutely nothing to improve the rail service!

As for the tram, unless they extend it to meet the line first, this is going to be yet another of those projects which makes things much worse for months.
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[COM] Re: Bowden Rail Tunnel

#9 Post by rhino » Thu May 26, 2011 3:10 pm

Aidan wrote:Some of the things on the list are badly phrased (anything that could be expressed in km should be) but the message is almost inescapable: though this is not the most expensive thing that could be done, it would require a lot of money that could be put to better use.
Anyone with a barrow to push can find a better use for money that is spent on any project that is not their pet one.

While I am actually in favour of keeping the Keith Hospital open, pointing out that the money spent on this project could keep the Keith Hospital open for 1152 years is beyond ridiculous. Similarly, running the Parks Community Centre for 174 years is ridiculous, but that doesn't mean I'm for closing it.

And this project will be good for rail. It will take the pax line under the freight line, and rail will be available to the Bowden TOD without slicing the project in two, thereby making rail a more preferred transport option. You, in your wisdom, can tell us that these things bring no benefit to rail, but others beg to differ.
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[COM] Re: Bowden Rail Tunnel

#10 Post by ricecrackers » Thu May 26, 2011 3:15 pm

Aidan wrote: There are many places in Adelaide where rail tunnels would be a good idea. IMO this isn't one of them because it would do absolutely nothing to improve the rail service!

As for the tram, unless they extend it to meet the line first, this is going to be yet another of those projects which makes things much worse for months.
:roll:

its supposed to reduce congestion on Park Tce

no tunnel will make a god damn deal of difference to the rail service as trains always get priority. :sly:

i wonder if they've costed an overpass. might be a cheaper compromise though i expect the developers of the TOD are hoping to get some additional commonwealth funding to get a greater return on their real estate
If 50 million believe in a fallacy, it is still a fallacy..." Professor S.W. Carey

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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#11 Post by metro » Thu May 26, 2011 3:35 pm

i am curious to how they would build it, compared with similar projects i've seen, it could take over a year to build. Would they really make people change from train to bus (or tram if they extend it to croydon station) for over a year or is temporary track around the construction site included in the cost of $418m?

Also would be great if they could find a way to include the separation of the South rd level crossing too.

But this is a great idea, hopefully it happens soon :cheers:

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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#12 Post by rhino » Thu May 26, 2011 3:51 pm

metro wrote:Also would be great if they could find a way to include the separation of the South rd level crossing too.
I don't think they would include South Road lx in this project, as doing that will make it harder to tunnel South Road under Port Road at a later date. The South Road Level Crossing will be removed, but as part of that other project later on I think.
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[COM] Re: Bowden Rail Tunnel

#13 Post by Aidan » Thu May 26, 2011 5:10 pm

rhino wrote:
Aidan wrote:Some of the things on the list are badly phrased (anything that could be expressed in km should be) but the message is almost inescapable: though this is not the most expensive thing that could be done, it would require a lot of money that could be put to better use.
Anyone with a barrow to push can find a better use for money that is spent on any project that is not their pet one.
True, but few projects would have a lower benefit:cost ratio than this one. Unfortunately the benefits are rather difficult to quantify, so it is entirely sensible for journalists to compare it with existing projects, as that will give the public some idea of the relative costs and benefits.
While I am actually in favour of keeping the Keith Hospital open, pointing out that the money spent on this project could keep the Keith Hospital open for 1152 years is beyond ridiculous. Similarly, running the Parks Community Centre for 174 years is ridiculous, but that doesn't mean I'm for closing it.
When the government claims it can't afford to keep it open, do you not see the point of pointing out how much the cost of a less important project that the government favours could keep it open for?
And this project will be good for rail. It will take the pax line under the freight line, and rail will be available to the Bowden TOD without slicing the project in two, thereby making rail a more preferred transport option. You, in your wisdom, can tell us that these things bring no benefit to rail, but others beg to differ.
It will benefit the interstate trains slightly, but not the local trains as they already get signal priority.

Not slicing the Bowden TOD in two won't make rail a more preferred transport option for its residents. It will make it more lucrative for the developers, but nowhere near $418 million more lucrative! Similarly it will bring in more land tax and council rates, but again nowhere near $418 million.

It's would be utterly ludicrous to build this tunnel yet fail to build the one we desperately need under the CBD while we still have the opportunity.

ricecrackers wrote:supposed to reduce congestion on Park Tce
Yes, that's another benefit - but how much congestion does that crossing really cause? Is it any more than a single set of traffic lights?

It's Torrens Road that really needs its crossing grade separated, not Park Terrace. And when that's done, there are still several others in urgent need of grade separation: Hove (Brighton Road), Unley Park (Cross Road), Goodwood (Leader Street), Oaklands...

For completeness I suppose I should mention the other benefit it would bring: some railway land returned to Parklands. However the relative positions of the Torrens and the other railway means it probably wouldn't be high value parklands.
Just build it wrote:Bye Union Hall. I'll see you in another life, when we are both cats.

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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#14 Post by [Shuz] » Thu May 26, 2011 5:35 pm

This is the kind of project that looks nice on paper, but would be a farce in reality.
Any views and opinions expressed are of my own, and do not reflect the views or opinions of any organisation of which I have an affiliation with.

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[COM] Re: PRO: Bowden Rail Tunnel | 1km $418m

#15 Post by AtD » Thu May 26, 2011 6:59 pm

Adian:

Two way traffic numbers for: total (commercial)
Park Terrace: 43,700 (2,200)
Brighton Road: 34,600 (1,850)
Cross Road Unley Park: 32,700 (1,250)
Torrens Road: 21,000 (950)
Leader Street: So trivial they don't even publish it.
http://www.transport.sa.gov.au/transpor ... olumes.asp

I would say Park Terrace is the busiest level crossing in the state. If not, it'd be in the top few. Yes, it doesn't get freight trains, but they don't come every 10 minutes.

FWIW, I would also prefer money be spent on something else PT wise.

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