News & Discussion: Trams

Threads relating to transport, water, etc. within the CBD and Metropolitan area.
Message
Author
User avatar
[Shuz]
Super Size Scraper Poster!
Posts: 2579
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2011 5:26 pm
Has thanked: 1007 times
Been thanked: 258 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4036 Post by [Shuz] » Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:59 am

Tram services were deplorable last night! It seemed to be as if they removed the EC-BG route and replaced it with the "Loop"? I managed to walk from BG to ARS in the time the tram just sat at BG. Pathetic.
Any views and opinions expressed are of my own, and do not reflect the views or opinions of any organisation of which I have an affiliation with.

User avatar
ChillyPhilly
Legendary Member!
Posts: 1402
Joined: Sun Dec 07, 2008 11:35 pm
Location: Adder-Laid, South Australia.
Has thanked: 260 times
Been thanked: 338 times
Contact:

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4037 Post by ChillyPhilly » Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:48 pm

[Shuz] wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:59 am
Tram services were deplorable last night! It seemed to be as if they removed the EC-BG route and replaced it with the "Loop"? I managed to walk from BG to ARS in the time the tram just sat at BG. Pathetic.
It's for the Fringe/Mad March season. I'd be alarmed if it's still like this after this period.
Our state, our city, our future.

All views expressed on this forum are my own.

Nort
Legendary Member!
Posts: 1101
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 2:08 pm
Has thanked: 222 times
Been thanked: 134 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4038 Post by Nort » Tue Feb 19, 2019 11:34 am

ChillyPhilly wrote:
Mon Feb 18, 2019 10:48 pm
[Shuz] wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:59 am
Tram services were deplorable last night! It seemed to be as if they removed the EC-BG route and replaced it with the "Loop"? I managed to walk from BG to ARS in the time the tram just sat at BG. Pathetic.
It's for the Fringe/Mad March season. I'd be alarmed if it's still like this after this period.
I don't think the problem is with the routes so much as the wait times which do seem unnecessary.

User avatar
Norman
Donating Member
Donating Member
Posts: 5664
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 1:06 pm
Has thanked: 767 times
Been thanked: 1366 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4039 Post by Norman » Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:12 pm

I believe the "Art Gallery" stop has been renamed as "State Library". The stop name signs have been changed at the stop.

claybro
Super Size Scraper Poster!
Posts: 1995
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 9:16 pm
Has thanked: 48 times
Been thanked: 215 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4040 Post by claybro » Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:54 pm

Without wishing to pile on about the various options of routes and identification of routes, I used the tram a bit on the weekend when I was there, and found it all a bit confusing. A sign saying "maximum 20 minutes wait" really shouldn't take the place of a timetable. And why not just leave the old Glenelg-Ent Centre route in place always, and have North/South and East/west shuttles within the CBD. The shuttles would take a bit of pressure off the Glenelg/Ent centre route and speed things up a bit, increase frequency and be more predictable. Also, for god sake get the drivers to pull their finger out, and stop leaving their cab to chat to guards, check imaginary problems, or act like they are an Airbus A380 captain.

User avatar
Nathan
Super Size Scraper Poster!
Posts: 3119
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 1:09 pm
Location: Bowden
Has thanked: 191 times
Been thanked: 608 times
Contact:

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4041 Post by Nathan » Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:08 pm

claybro wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:54 pm
Without wishing to pile on about the various options of routes and identification of routes, I used the tram a bit on the weekend when I was there, and found it all a bit confusing. A sign saying "maximum 20 minutes wait" really shouldn't take the place of a timetable. And why not just leave the old Glenelg-Ent Centre route in place always, and have North/South and East/west shuttles within the CBD. The shuttles would take a bit of pressure off the Glenelg/Ent centre route and speed things up a bit, increase frequency and be more predictable. Also, for god sake get the drivers to pull their finger out, and stop leaving their cab to chat to guards, check imaginary problems, or act like they are an Airbus A380 captain.
I think the Glenelg-Ent Centre route should be removed completely. The long route through the city guarantees there will be delays for nearly all trams out of the city. Just focus on two frequent routes that overlap for transfers, and no one at the Entertainment Centre wondering if they got on the right tram or not (because some drivers don't bother updating the destination screens until they leave the Ent Centre).

User avatar
Nathan
Super Size Scraper Poster!
Posts: 3119
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 1:09 pm
Location: Bowden
Has thanked: 191 times
Been thanked: 608 times
Contact:

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4042 Post by Nathan » Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:11 pm

Norman wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:12 pm
I believe the "Art Gallery" stop has been renamed as "State Library". The stop name signs have been changed at the stop.
Still officially called "Art Gallery", but they've tacked "State Library" and "Museum" on to the stop as well (and very poorly — they're like rectangular stickers with yellow backgrounds rather than cut vinyl)

User avatar
Llessur2002
Legendary Member!
Posts: 1462
Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:59 pm
Location: West Croydon
Has thanked: 434 times
Been thanked: 667 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4043 Post by Llessur2002 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:07 am

Bunch of numpties.
Adelaide City Council set to oppose plans for major upgrade of King William St tram track — over loss of right turns

The axing of right-hand turns for motorists and 50 parking spaces, to allow for tram stop and track upgrades on King William St, has Adelaide City Council headed for a showdown with the State Government.

Design work is underway on the government’s $17.5 million project, announced last month, to upgrade the City South tram stop for disability access and replace the tracks in the southern half of the street.

Six right-hand turns will be cut and motorists will be banned from the tram lane, with works to start within months.

But a majority of councillors, led by south ward councillor Alexander Hyde, are expected to vote on Tuesday night to lobby the government to retain as many turns and parking spaces as possible.

Councillors would also call on the government to consider allowing cars to stay in the tram lane, and to look at a “split stop” platform.

That means a platform for one direction of tram travel would be on the southern side of the intersection of King William St with Sturt and Halifax streets, and a second platform for the other direction on the northern side.

Cr Hyde told The Advertiser he believed the only right-hand turns that should be removed were the ones around the City South stop itself — northbound King William St traffic turning right on to Halifax St, and eastbound Sturt St traffic turning right on to King William St.

“Accessibility is the number one issue raised by businesses in the city,” Cr Hyde said.

“Removing so many right turns effectively cuts our city in half, making it harder for visitors, shoppers and residents to get around.

“The State Government have done a thorough consultation and I hope my ratepayers’ concerns are reflected in the final design.”

Transport Minister Stephan Knoll took a dim view of the proposal from Cr Hyde, a fellow Liberal Party member.

“If Cr Hyde wants to maintain right-hand turns and the current carparking configuration, that would result in either the footpath, bike lanes or a through-traffic lane being removed,” he said.

“Any or a combination of these could lead to increased traffic congestion and travel delays which would deliver a worse outcome for commuters and the community.”

At least six of the 11 councillors are set to back Cr Hyde on Tuesday night.

Deputy Lord Mayor Houssam Abiad said the project was long overdue, but could be refined.

“I don’t know why Adelaide is the only capital city in the country where we cannot drive on the tram tracks,” he said.

“It has never made sense to me … it would reduce congestion.”

Cars are already banned from driving on the tram tracks north of Victoria Square.

Cr Franz Knoll, father of Stephan, said he would also support the motion.

“We don’t want to destroy that (southernend) of King William (St) like what has happened with the northern (end),” he said.

“The city needs to be accessible.”

Cr Anne Moran also said the council needed to avoid what happened at the northern end of King William St.
From: https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/messenge ... 5c467d2eed

User avatar
Kasey771
Legendary Member!
Posts: 598
Joined: Sun Feb 21, 2010 8:56 am
Has thanked: 193 times
Been thanked: 80 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4044 Post by Kasey771 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:19 am

Llessur2002 wrote:Bunch of numpties.
Adelaide City Council set to oppose plans for major upgrade of King William St tram track — over loss of right turns

The axing of right-hand turns for motorists and 50 parking spaces, to allow for tram stop and track upgrades on King William St, has Adelaide City Council headed for a showdown with the State Government.

Design work is underway on the government’s $17.5 million project, announced last month, to upgrade the City South tram stop for disability access and replace the tracks in the southern half of the street.

Six right-hand turns will be cut and motorists will be banned from the tram lane, with works to start within months.

But a majority of councillors, led by south ward councillor Alexander Hyde, are expected to vote on Tuesday night to lobby the government to retain as many turns and parking spaces as possible.

Councillors would also call on the government to consider allowing cars to stay in the tram lane, and to look at a “split stop” platform.

That means a platform for one direction of tram travel would be on the southern side of the intersection of King William St with Sturt and Halifax streets, and a second platform for the other direction on the northern side.

Cr Hyde told The Advertiser he believed the only right-hand turns that should be removed were the ones around the City South stop itself — northbound King William St traffic turning right on to Halifax St, and eastbound Sturt St traffic turning right on to King William St.

“Accessibility is the number one issue raised by businesses in the city,” Cr Hyde said.

“Removing so many right turns effectively cuts our city in half, making it harder for visitors, shoppers and residents to get around.

“The State Government have done a thorough consultation and I hope my ratepayers’ concerns are reflected in the final design.”

Transport Minister Stephan Knoll took a dim view of the proposal from Cr Hyde, a fellow Liberal Party member.

“If Cr Hyde wants to maintain right-hand turns and the current carparking configuration, that would result in either the footpath, bike lanes or a through-traffic lane being removed,” he said.

“Any or a combination of these could lead to increased traffic congestion and travel delays which would deliver a worse outcome for commuters and the community.”

At least six of the 11 councillors are set to back Cr Hyde on Tuesday night.

Deputy Lord Mayor Houssam Abiad said the project was long overdue, but could be refined.

“I don’t know why Adelaide is the only capital city in the country where we cannot drive on the tram tracks,” he said.

“It has never made sense to me … it would reduce congestion.”

Cars are already banned from driving on the tram tracks north of Victoria Square.

Cr Franz Knoll, father of Stephan, said he would also support the motion.

“We don’t want to destroy that (southernend) of King William (St) like what has happened with the northern (end),” he said.

“The city needs to be accessible.”

Cr Anne Moran also said the council needed to avoid what happened at the northern end of King William St.
From: https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/messenge ... 5c467d2eed
If the ability to turn right is so important... make those intersections hook turns. Just don’t park your crappy Camry carrying only a driver in front of a tram carrying up to 60 passengers while you wait for a gap to turn right!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Big infrastructure investments are usually under-valued and & over-criticized while in the planning stage. It's much easier to envision the here and now costs and inconveniences, and far more difficult to imagine fully the eventual benefits.

User avatar
SRW
Donating Member
Donating Member
Posts: 2373
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2007 9:42 pm
Location: City
Has thanked: 528 times
Been thanked: 227 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4045 Post by SRW » Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:22 am

Oh for goodness' sake. Hopefully this bleating for myopic ratepayers doesn't actually inhibit a necessary public transport upgrade.

If right turns are such an issue, and I seriously doubt significant traffic effects, maybe it's time to look at hook turns.
Keep Adelaide Weird

Patrick_27
Super Size Scraper Poster!
Posts: 1692
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:41 pm
Location: Adelaide CBD, SA
Been thanked: 204 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4046 Post by Patrick_27 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:47 am

I can see the issue with both the right-hand turns and parking being removed, parking is a revenue stream for the ACC; but it's only fifty parks. As for right-hand turns, perhaps it's now worth exploring hook-turns for this stretch of KWS? I know that Adelaide motorists are a special breed and will likely struggle with the concept early on, but if we're adamant about reintroducing trams into our PT system, then it's inevitable that hook-turns will become a thing. I hope the plans don't change on this, it's long overdue and the fact that this section of track is so inconsistent (and has remained so for so long) with the remainder of the network is embarrassing.

User avatar
Nathan
Super Size Scraper Poster!
Posts: 3119
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2009 1:09 pm
Location: Bowden
Has thanked: 191 times
Been thanked: 608 times
Contact:

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4047 Post by Nathan » Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:03 pm

KWS north of Vic Sq has 2 lanes and no ability to drive on tracks, so I fail to understand why the southern end — which has less traffic — needs the tram lane for cars as well.

Not having a right turn may be a minor annoyance if you don't know where you're going, but surely anyone with a modicum of intelligence (or a GPS in their car) can easily navigate an alternative route. The city is on a simple grid FFS, it's not difficult even if you don't know every side street or lane.

User avatar
mshagg
Legendary Member!
Posts: 551
Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2011 10:50 pm
Has thanked: 89 times
Been thanked: 129 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4048 Post by mshagg » Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:28 pm

If the commercial genius' that make up the base of ACC's "ratepayers" (most of whom, I would submit, are actually landlords and not the people running the businesses) cant appreciate the value of vastly improved tram services running past their door step, there's very little hope for them.

ACC: "The hell with consultative processes if I don't get what I want"

User avatar
[Shuz]
Super Size Scraper Poster!
Posts: 2579
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2011 5:26 pm
Has thanked: 1007 times
Been thanked: 258 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4049 Post by [Shuz] » Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:51 pm

It seems that this ragtag bunch of councillors have one thing in common. Lack of common sense.
Any views and opinions expressed are of my own, and do not reflect the views or opinions of any organisation of which I have an affiliation with.

A-Town
Sen-Rookie-Sational
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:14 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 10 times

Re: News & Discussion: Trams

#4050 Post by A-Town » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:14 pm

Kasey771 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:19 am
Llessur2002 wrote:Bunch of numpties.
Adelaide City Council set to oppose plans for major upgrade of King William St tram track — over loss of right turns

The axing of right-hand turns for motorists and 50 parking spaces, to allow for tram stop and track upgrades on King William St, has Adelaide City Council headed for a showdown with the State Government.

Design work is underway on the government’s $17.5 million project, announced last month, to upgrade the City South tram stop for disability access and replace the tracks in the southern half of the street.

Six right-hand turns will be cut and motorists will be banned from the tram lane, with works to start within months.

But a majority of councillors, led by south ward councillor Alexander Hyde, are expected to vote on Tuesday night to lobby the government to retain as many turns and parking spaces as possible.

Councillors would also call on the government to consider allowing cars to stay in the tram lane, and to look at a “split stop” platform.

That means a platform for one direction of tram travel would be on the southern side of the intersection of King William St with Sturt and Halifax streets, and a second platform for the other direction on the northern side.

Cr Hyde told The Advertiser he believed the only right-hand turns that should be removed were the ones around the City South stop itself — northbound King William St traffic turning right on to Halifax St, and eastbound Sturt St traffic turning right on to King William St.

“Accessibility is the number one issue raised by businesses in the city,” Cr Hyde said.

“Removing so many right turns effectively cuts our city in half, making it harder for visitors, shoppers and residents to get around.

“The State Government have done a thorough consultation and I hope my ratepayers’ concerns are reflected in the final design.”

Transport Minister Stephan Knoll took a dim view of the proposal from Cr Hyde, a fellow Liberal Party member.

“If Cr Hyde wants to maintain right-hand turns and the current carparking configuration, that would result in either the footpath, bike lanes or a through-traffic lane being removed,” he said.

“Any or a combination of these could lead to increased traffic congestion and travel delays which would deliver a worse outcome for commuters and the community.”

At least six of the 11 councillors are set to back Cr Hyde on Tuesday night.

Deputy Lord Mayor Houssam Abiad said the project was long overdue, but could be refined.

“I don’t know why Adelaide is the only capital city in the country where we cannot drive on the tram tracks,” he said.

“It has never made sense to me … it would reduce congestion.”

Cars are already banned from driving on the tram tracks north of Victoria Square.

Cr Franz Knoll, father of Stephan, said he would also support the motion.

“We don’t want to destroy that (southernend) of King William (St) like what has happened with the northern (end),” he said.

“The city needs to be accessible.”

Cr Anne Moran also said the council needed to avoid what happened at the northern end of King William St.
From: https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/messenge ... 5c467d2eed
If the ability to turn right is so important... make those intersections hook turns. Just don’t park your crappy Camry carrying only a driver in front of a tram carrying up to 60 passengers while you wait for a gap to turn right!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I agree, but can you imagine Adelaide drivers trying to complete a hook turn? :hilarious:

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests