News & Discussion: Electricity Infrastructure

[rogue]

Wayno,

Not 100% sure, but there may have been a bowling green there once upon a time and they were the clubrooms.

[mattblack]

Found this concept plan for Port Road.
http://www.charlessturt.sa.gov.au/webda ... _plans.pdf

The aim of the project is to transform Port Road into a grand boulevard by creating wetlands and removing those ugly stobie poles. Looks good

Speaking to someone from Charles - Sturt and there is no way that this project will go ahead due to lack of funds and no Fed or State financing will be forthcoming in the foreseeable future.

[rhino]

Australian-first floating solar farm due to begin construction in SA

From ABC News On Line:

An Australian-first floating solar power plant is expected to be operational in South Australia by early April, with construction about to get underway.

The plant will float on a wastewater treatment facility in Jamestown in the state's mid north.

Felicia Whiting of Infratech Industries said the plant was designed so that much of the construction could be carried out offsite and slotted together at the facility.

"We should see some plant on the site within about two weeks," Ms Whiting said.

She also explained that as the solar panels were floating they would be kept cool by the water mass, making them about 57 per cent more efficient than land-based solar panels.

"It prevents water evaporation up to 90 per cent of the surface area covered, and for dry states and dry climates that's a big water saving measure," Ms Whiting said.

"It prevents the outbreak of blue-green algae by keeping the surface water cool, which is for treated wastewater an issue in water quality.

"By preventing photosynthesis, the energy from the sun goes into the panel rather than into the water."

Infratech has developed floating solar power plants in countries such as France and South Korea, but the company had seen them as test sites for the new and improved model planned for South Australia.

"The plants that we had operating overseas were really behind the meter and not at the utility level and certainly didn't have some of the sophistication," Ms Whiting said.

The South Australian plant was expected to produce not only enough energy to power its co-located wastewater treatment facility, but have excess power flow-on to the township of Jamestown.

"The water treatment plants are heavy uses of power for the actual water treatments and pumping," Ms Whiting said.

"Quite sustainably, with no additional use of land, we can use the water surface to power the water treatment facility.

"In addition to that, because we're so efficient, we're able to export power to the township."

Once operational, Ms Whiting said the plant would become Infratech's showpiece for export around the world.

"We've invested our whole research and development program in this technology over the past two years in South Australia," she said.

"We have other councils waiting to have a look at this and see how it might be adapted to a water basin or a community wastewater management scheme.

"The fact that we are using Australian engineering and it's an Australian supply chain - that will be taken internationally."

[rubberman]

I think the latest developments in the power saga rate a mention.

The Premier yesterday announced a $550m package of generation, battery storage, exploration incentives and market controls to address energy market deficiencies that have impacted SA recently.

[Norman]

I think the latest developments in the power saga rate a mention.

The Premier yesterday announced a $550m package of generation, battery storage, exploration incentives and market controls to address energy market deficiencies that have impacted SA recently.

There are already multiple threads discussing this. A moderator should consolidate those posts.

[rubberman]

I think the latest developments in the power saga rate a mention.

The Premier yesterday announced a $550m package of generation, battery storage, exploration incentives and market controls to address energy market deficiencies that have impacted SA recently.

There are already multiple threads discussing this. A moderator should consolidate those posts.

The pub posts seem to be mainly political though. It would be good for the political stuff to stay there.

There's surely some interest from a purely infrastructure pov.

[monotonehell]

I think the latest developments in the power saga rate a mention.

The Premier yesterday announced a $550m package of generation, battery storage, exploration incentives and market controls to address energy market deficiencies that have impacted SA recently.

There are already multiple threads discussing this. A moderator should consolidate those posts.

The pub posts seem to be mainly political though. It would be good for the political stuff to stay there.

There's surely some interest from a purely infrastructure pov.

I guess when there's some actual infrastructure announced. Right now it's still political vision stuff. And the Feds are making it a political football.

By the way, this thread makes interesting reading from the start - what happened to those two power plants from 2007?

[SBD]

By the way, this thread makes interesting reading from the start - what happened to those two power plants from 2007?

It's "on hold" until they know whether Kevin Rudd will be elected and introduce an emissions trading scheme and how it will work. I guess it did the job of discouraging investment in fossil fuel electricity.

http://blogs.abc.net.au/sa/2008/08/mallala-power-s.html

Mallala power station 'on hold'

13/08/2008 , 1:36 PM by Tom Henderson

A major power plant that got development approval last year for Mallala has been put on hold until the company, Babcock and Brown Power, knows more about the Federal Governments emissions trading scheme.

The proposal to build the plant in Mallala would be a major benefit to the local community according to the Chief Executive Officer of the Mallala District Council, Damien Maloney.

"It's something that isn't there at the moment, this is something that would give us a shot in the arm and we'll still be happy that it starts up next year", Mr Maloney told North and West Mornings.

"In this particular case, there's no doubt the power station from what I've seen stacks up, now whether it stacks up both now and in the future that's what their probably going to look at particularly in light of the green paper from the Federal Government".

[monotonehell]

Bwaha, my question was rhetorical. But lol anyway.

[Vee]

Lyon Group announces $1b battery and solar farm for SA Riverland
Good news for clean energy, energy security and jobs for SA.
(Move to new topic/thread?)

A $1 billion battery and solar farm will be built at Morgan in South Australia's Riverland by year's end in a project the proponents describe as "the world's biggest".

The builder, Lyon Group, has already proposed a smaller solar farm and battery storage facility, named Kingfisher, in the state's north.
Lyon partner David Green said the project was 100 per cent equity financed and construction would begin within months, employing 270 workers.

"Riverland Solar Storage's 330-megawatt solar generation and 100-megawatt battery storage system will be Australia's biggest solar farm with 3.4 million solar panels and will also include 1.1 million batteries."

Mr Green said land had already been secured and grid connection was already well advanced.

Work on Lyon's 120 megawatt Kingfisher project is slated to begin in September next year.

Mid Murray Council chief executive Russell Peate said such an announcement in this "day and age of employment" was "brilliant" news for the region.

"From an employment perspective, that will have a massive effect on the Riverland and particularly Morgan."

"We will need to work with the developer in terms of accommodation, but it will also impact on school enrolments, the Country Fire Service, ambulance volunteers — and that will be fantastic for that area."

Lyon to bid for SA battery tender

The Lyon Group has already signalled its intention to bid for a SA Government tender to build a battery storage system with 100-megawatt output.
....
Mr Green said the outcome of the tender would not determine whether or not Lyon's projects were built, but would influence the final storage configuration in terms of the balance between optimising grid security and capture of trading revenue.

"The SA Government's leadership on large-scale battery storage has come together with technology cost reductions and international financial interest to provide a timely solution to some of the challenges in the state's electricity system."

The accompanying table provides details of the two Company projects, one (Riverland) at Morgan, the other (Kingfisher) at Roxby Downs.



ABC News:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-03-30/n ... nd/8400952

[Goodsy]

great news for SA and the Riverland

[Waewick]

really excited about this proposal.
was also interested in Mr X getting the solar plant loan for Port Augusta confirmed.

Do we have any electrcity experts here? with both these solar storage systems going ahead is there less need for the gas fired plant the government is proposing?

[rubberman]

really excited about this proposal.
was also interested in Mr X getting the solar plant loan for Port Augusta confirmed.

Do we have any electrcity experts here? with both these solar storage systems going ahead is there less need for the gas fired plant the government is proposing?

Not an expert, but what I do know is that gas fired power stations take about half an hour to start up (with some small variation). So, the battery storage provides power while the gas turbines spin up.

Next, part of the reason for the battery storage is to cover very short term fluctuations in system voltage that caused wind turbine shutdown. Typically, automatic protection might trip and reset a breaker on a line twice over two minutes. If the breaker trips again within that time, the circuit is shut down till a human can oversee the problem. That's enough to burn off birds and bats occasionally, but if it's something bigger, best look at it. Battery storage can smooth that out. So, batteries act as a complement to the gas turbines. Also, the turbines can run for extended periods, batteries, not so much. Finally, some of the biggest cost gouging has been from companies witholding supply till prices go through the roof. Batteries and turbines operated by the government would foil that racket.

[SBD]

...
Finally, some of the biggest cost gouging has been from companies witholding supply till prices go through the roof. Batteries and turbines operated by the government would foil that racket.

Either the Government participates in the market, and also benefits from the price spikes to turn a profit (or at least be cost neutral), or it doesn't, in which case the impact on the market is simply a reduction in demand. The market will adjust so that over time, the current situation will return, by not investing in its most marginal generators (current examples being the closure of Northern and Hazelwood).

The government needs to react by changing the rules of the game, not by joining it.

[rubberman]

...
Finally, some of the biggest cost gouging has been from companies witholding supply till prices go through the roof. Batteries and turbines operated by the government would foil that racket.

The government needs to react by changing the rules of the game, not by joining it.

That's a statement of ideological belief. We actually got to the point where we are today by various sides of the debate following ideology rather than pragmatism.

So, yes perhaps had the Federal government changed the rules a few years ago, things might be different. However, there's no point in saying what they should have done, when the problems are more immediate. I note that several of the representatives of generation companies recently stated there should be a price on carbon. We know how that went, don't we?

While I sort of agree with you philosophically, from a practical perspective, it hasn't worked, and we either face reality, that is we won't see the price on carbon the private sector says we need, nor will we see the Federal government doing anything in time to keep the lights on.

And as for the Snowy Scheme? That parallels with the NBN are eerie:

1). ALP comes up with a plan, then
2). Coalition comes up with something else it touts as being better, then
3). We get a half thought out inferior more costly NBN.

How the Snowy Scheme (only trotted out after the SA Government announces something) is going to be done for $2Bn is a complete mystery. There's 28kM of tunnels. How much did 13kM of tunnel in Melbourne cost under Napthine?