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[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:50 am
by omada
I use the Belair Line regularly and from what I can tell, the service is very well patronised (especially during peak hour).
Someone mentioned closing stations, I don't think that is required, Lynton is actually a very busy stop.
Even in its current form (without much improvement), the service is still a relatively quick and painless way to commute into the city. I think people are just lazy, they are addicted to their vehicles. We need to increase patronage somehow, we have to question why Australian's don't use P.T , car transport is still too convenient and doesn't factor in the true cost to the user. But, any change to this system requires leaders with courage and vision and we all know that this is an issue with Australian political landscape at present.
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:04 am
by claybro
gnrc_louis wrote: ↑Thu Jun 27, 2019 10:47 pm
What? No - I'm saying a Labor Government is not going to advocate closure of a trainline which runs through electorates of their two most prominent MPs. Even more so because Lee is very marginal and is heavily serviced by the Grange train.
"Dry Creek spur" (by which I presume you mean Dry Creek to Port Adelaide) and Grange are not comparable lines imo - the former didn't have an end destination of the city. As I mentioned in my other post, the Grange line has actually had seemingly greater patronage in recent years (admittedly mostly at certain times/events), with continuing higher density development to come around Grange likely to encourage this further. If more people are to regularly catch public transport (a goal any decent State government should have) in this part of the western suburbs, this growth will absolutely not happen from buses. Hence, why rail is crucial.
I'm not suggesting Labor would close Grange...Labor aren't in power, and Liberal don't like anything with rails. So yes, I am suggesting if the grange spur causes too many cost "blowouts"...its gone. Just like the Port dock spur- alleged cost blowout-gone.
Re Dry Creek....no not DC to Port Adelaide. There used to be a spur off the Gawler line called "Dry Creek" It terminated somewhere near Ingle Farm. Largely traversed the stock sale yards, and some low scale residential almost identical to the Grange setup. It was not viable, it was closed, and has never been revived, despite increasing population, and many years of Labor state governments. To be clear, I am not advocating for closure of rail. But years of procrastinating, lack of serious urban consolidation and utilising existing rail infrastructure leaves parts of the system vulnerable to closure. Adelaide has the backbone of a great rail system still, but for some reason various governments have not been able to capitalise and what is already there.
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 12:21 pm
by Spotto
claybro wrote: ↑Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:04 am
gnrc_louis wrote: ↑Thu Jun 27, 2019 10:47 pm
What? No - I'm saying a Labor Government is not going to advocate closure of a trainline which runs through electorates of their two most prominent MPs. Even more so because Lee is very marginal and is heavily serviced by the Grange train.
"Dry Creek spur" (by which I presume you mean Dry Creek to Port Adelaide) and Grange are not comparable lines imo - the former didn't have an end destination of the city. As I mentioned in my other post, the Grange line has actually had seemingly greater patronage in recent years (admittedly mostly at certain times/events), with continuing higher density development to come around Grange likely to encourage this further. If more people are to regularly catch public transport (a goal any decent State government should have) in this part of the western suburbs, this growth will absolutely not happen from buses. Hence, why rail is crucial.
I'm not suggesting Labor would close Grange...Labor aren't in power, and Liberal don't like anything with rails. So yes, I am suggesting if the grange spur causes too many cost "blowouts"...its gone. Just like the Port dock spur- alleged cost blowout-gone.
Re Dry Creek....no not DC to Port Adelaide.
There used to be a spur off the Gawler line called "Dry Creek" It terminated somewhere near Ingle Farm. Largely traversed the stock sale yards, and some low scale residential almost identical to the Grange setup. It was not viable, it was closed, and has never been revived, despite increasing population, and many years of Labor state governments. To be clear, I am not advocating for closure of rail. But years of procrastinating, lack of serious urban consolidation and utilising existing rail infrastructure leaves parts of the system vulnerable to closure. Adelaide has the backbone of a great rail system still, but for some reason various governments have not been able to capitalise and what is already there.
The Northfield line ran from Dry Creek to Northfield station at Briens Road. It serviced the old abattoirs and for a time had passenger services too but was eventually reduced to freight only before it closed. The triangular junction off of the Gawler line is now occupied by the Dry Creek Depot.
According to Wikipedia, trains that used to run onward to Northfield were changed to terminate at Dry Creek instead.
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:36 pm
by Patrick_27
omada wrote: ↑Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:50 am
Someone mentioned closing stations, I don't think that is required, Lynton is actually a very busy stop.
That was me. Agree that Lynton is a busy stop, but I'm looking at it more from the perspective that Torrens Park is way ridiculously close to Mitcham, and Lynton is too far for the people that use Torrens Park if they were to close that station. Whereas if they were to reopen Clapham, it would sit halfway between where both Lynton and Torrens Park are currently and would allow for better bus connections with Springbank Road above. So I'm suggesting it more from a practicality point of view.
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 5:41 pm
by Waewick
Does anyone work in the Port area?
I was talking to some business owners who said they knew this had be cancelled last year?
Apparently issues with hooking up bus services and the desire of the council to have the bus services integrated was causing issues (not in a bad way just in getting it to work).
It all sounded like they had gotten confused with all the announcements. Thought this would be the place to check
[U/C] Re: [PRO] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 5:49 pm
by ChillyPhilly
Waewick wrote:Does anyone work in the Port area?
I was talking to some business owners who said they knew this had be cancelled last year?
Apparently issues with hooking up bus services and the desire of the council to have the bus services integrated was causing issues (not in a bad way just in getting it to work).
It all sounded like they had gotten confused with all the announcements. Thought this would be the place to check
I did until April, and came across no talk of the sort.
[U/C] Re: [PRO] Re: [PRO] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 8:53 pm
by Waewick
ChillyPhilly wrote:Waewick wrote:Does anyone work in the Port area?
I was talking to some business owners who said they knew this had be cancelled last year?
Apparently issues with hooking up bus services and the desire of the council to have the bus services integrated was causing issues (not in a bad way just in getting it to work).
It all sounded like they had gotten confused with all the announcements. Thought this would be the place to check
I did until April, and came across no talk of the sort.
I'll go with confused people. I figured as much, just wanted to check
[U/C] Re: [PRO] Re: [PRO] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:07 pm
by Honey of a City
Waewick wrote: ↑Sun Jun 30, 2019 8:53 pm
ChillyPhilly wrote:Waewick wrote:Does anyone work in the Port area?
I was talking to some business owners who said they knew this had be cancelled last year?
Apparently issues with hooking up bus services and the desire of the council to have the bus services integrated was causing issues (not in a bad way just in getting it to work).
It all sounded like they had gotten confused with all the announcements. Thought this would be the place to check
I did until April, and came across no talk of the sort.
I'll go with confused people. I figured as much, just wanted to check
I live, work and volunteer in the area and haven’t heard any talk of the project being canned until just now. There was a kerfuffle a while back about the bus interchange to be built adjacent the new station. The concern was by local residents and bike users and the safety factor of increased bus movements in Lipson St. The government announced going back to the drawing board re the buses but no mention of pulling the plug on the whole spur line. There is a lot of dismay over the scrapping of the project because a heap of money has been spent locally in anticipation of its completion.
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:18 pm
by 1NEEDS2POST
PD2/20 wrote: ↑Thu Jun 27, 2019 9:10 am
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Wed Jun 26, 2019 10:32 pm
Why did developers (and the government enable) this residential development? We should only be building high density around existing railway stations. This is why we can't have high quality public transport in Adelaide.
It's not clear which residential development you are referring to? Port Dock? Glanville?
I meant the Port Adelaide development near Port Dock. We already have a reasonably large rail network for a city of this size. It's just that we don't build density around the existing stations!
The same goes for the Grange line, it goes to a lovely beachside suburb not far from the city, but there is no density!
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:35 am
by muzzamo
he National Railway Museum, which ripped out tracks in anticipation of a new rail spur in to the heart of Port Adelaide, will still receive $60,000 in compensation from the State Government despite its decision to shelve the project.
Museum chairman David Burnett and executive officer Bob Sampson met with Transport Department representatives last week, and were told the museum would still be compensated for lost revenue and the cost of clearing the site.
The State Government announced last month that it was putting the Port Dock Railway Station project — announced by the Labor Government in 2017 — on hold after a review found that it would cost an extra $24 million than originally budgeted.
The expected cost of building the 1km spur line off the existing Outer Harbor line had more than doubled from $16.4 million to $40 million.
Instead, the State Government will undertake a study into public transport options in the northwestern suburbs in the hope of finding a cheaper option.
The museum, which is located next to where a new station was proposed to be built on Baker St, had ripped up part of its railway tracks and moved equipment from storage — preventing it from running large trains such as its Red Hen.
National Railway Museum executive officer Bob Sampson. Picture: Campbell Brodie
National Railway Museum executive officer Bob Sampson. Picture: Campbell Brodie
It is planning to use the $60,000 compensation money to upgrade the museum’s facilities including building a new undercover area where children can climb a steam train.
Mr Burnett said the Transport Department would also reinstall the tracks except for where it would require “major removal” should the rail spur get the green light again.
“The two short sections surrounding both sides of No. 1 (rail track) turnout is the focus,” Mr Burnett said.
“Additionally, the existing Jacketts No. 1 (track) will be extended northwards and slewed at the northern end to provide access into the Jacketts station platform.”
He said this would allow a possible restart of Peronne, Redhen and Bluebird steam trains early next year.
“We are happy with the level of compensation and the other matters that have been agreed to,” Mr Burnett said.
“This will enable the National Railway Museum to move forward on specific projects, all for the betterment of the museum.”
As the revitalisation of Port Adelaide has got underway, traders have called for the return of the Port Dock Station to deliver passengers into the heart of the Port.
Trains to the centre of Port Adelaide stopped in 1981 and the station was demolished in 1989 to make way for the Port Adelaide police station.
The current Port Adelaide Railway Station is a 1km away next to the Port Adelaide Plaza.
The new station was to be opposite the Dock One housing development where 750 new homes will soon be under construction.
Transport Minister Stephan Knoll said at the time of the announced shelving that a “responsible” State Government needed to assess if the “significant increase in expenditure” would deliver the best public transport solution for the people of Port Adelaide and surrounding areas.
The study is expected to be completed within six to nine months.
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:36 am
by muzzamo
adelaidenow wrote:
The National Railway Museum, which ripped out tracks in anticipation of a new rail spur in to the heart of Port Adelaide, will still receive $60,000 in compensation from the State Government despite its decision to shelve the project.
Museum chairman David Burnett and executive officer Bob Sampson met with Transport Department representatives last week, and were told the museum would still be compensated for lost revenue and the cost of clearing the site.
The State Government announced last month that it was putting the Port Dock Railway Station project — announced by the Labor Government in 2017 — on hold after a review found that it would cost an extra $24 million than originally budgeted.
The expected cost of building the 1km spur line off the existing Outer Harbor line had more than doubled from $16.4 million to $40 million.
Instead, the State Government will undertake a study into public transport options in the northwestern suburbs in the hope of finding a cheaper option.
The museum, which is located next to where a new station was proposed to be built on Baker St, had ripped up part of its railway tracks and moved equipment from storage — preventing it from running large trains such as its Red Hen.
National Railway Museum executive officer Bob Sampson. Picture: Campbell Brodie
National Railway Museum executive officer Bob Sampson. Picture: Campbell Brodie
It is planning to use the $60,000 compensation money to upgrade the museum’s facilities including building a new undercover area where children can climb a steam train.
Mr Burnett said the Transport Department would also reinstall the tracks except for where it would require “major removal” should the rail spur get the green light again.
“The two short sections surrounding both sides of No. 1 (rail track) turnout is the focus,” Mr Burnett said.
“Additionally, the existing Jacketts No. 1 (track) will be extended northwards and slewed at the northern end to provide access into the Jacketts station platform.”
He said this would allow a possible restart of Peronne, Redhen and Bluebird steam trains early next year.
“We are happy with the level of compensation and the other matters that have been agreed to,” Mr Burnett said.
“This will enable the National Railway Museum to move forward on specific projects, all for the betterment of the museum.”
As the revitalisation of Port Adelaide has got underway, traders have called for the return of the Port Dock Station to deliver passengers into the heart of the Port.
Trains to the centre of Port Adelaide stopped in 1981 and the station was demolished in 1989 to make way for the Port Adelaide police station.
The current Port Adelaide Railway Station is a 1km away next to the Port Adelaide Plaza.
The new station was to be opposite the Dock One housing development where 750 new homes will soon be under construction.
Transport Minister Stephan Knoll said at the time of the announced shelving that a “responsible” State Government needed to assess if the “significant increase in expenditure” would deliver the best public transport solution for the people of Port Adelaide and surrounding areas.
The study is expected to be completed within six to nine months.
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:58 am
by PD2/20
muzzamo wrote: ↑Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:36 am
The National Railway Museum, which ripped out tracks in anticipation of a new rail spur in to the heart of Port Adelaide, will still receive $60,000 in compensation from the State Government despite its decision to shelve the project.
Museum chairman David Burnett and executive officer Bob Sampson met with Transport Department representatives last week, and were told the museum would still be compensated for lost revenue and the cost of clearing the site.
The State Government announced last month that it was putting the Port Dock Railway Station project — announced by the Labor Government in 2017 — on hold after a review found that it would cost an extra $24 million than originally budgeted.
The expected cost of building the 1km spur line off the existing Outer Harbor line had more than doubled from $16.4 million to $40 million.
Instead, the State Government will undertake a study into public transport options in the northwestern suburbs in the hope of finding a cheaper option.
The museum, which is located next to where a new station was proposed to be built on Baker St, had ripped up part of its railway tracks and moved equipment from storage — preventing it from running large trains such as its Red Hen.
National Railway Museum executive officer Bob Sampson. Picture: Campbell Brodie
National Railway Museum executive officer Bob Sampson. Picture: Campbell Brodie
It is planning to use the $60,000 compensation money to upgrade the museum’s facilities including building a new undercover area where children can climb a steam train.
Mr Burnett said the Transport Department would also reinstall the tracks except for where it would require “major removal” should the rail spur get the green light again.
“The two short sections surrounding both sides of No. 1 (rail track) turnout is the focus,” Mr Burnett said.
“Additionally, the existing Jacketts No. 1 (track) will be extended northwards and slewed at the northern end to provide access into the Jacketts station platform.”
He said this would allow a possible restart of Peronne, Redhen and Bluebird steam trains early next year.
“We are happy with the level of compensation and the other matters that have been agreed to,” Mr Burnett said.
“This will enable the National Railway Museum to move forward on specific projects, all for the betterment of the museum.”
As the revitalisation of Port Adelaide has got underway, traders have called for the return of the Port Dock Station to deliver passengers into the heart of the Port.
Trains to the centre of Port Adelaide stopped in 1981 and the station was demolished in 1989 to make way for the Port Adelaide police station.
The current Port Adelaide Railway Station is a 1km away next to the Port Adelaide Plaza.
The new station was to be opposite the Dock One housing development where 750 new homes will soon be under construction.
Transport Minister Stephan Knoll said at the time of the announced shelving that a “responsible” State Government needed to assess if the “significant increase in expenditure” would deliver the best public transport solution for the people of Port Adelaide and surrounding areas.
The study is expected to be completed within six to nine months.
Source of quote?
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 10:05 am
by Eurostar
Firstly trucks should be stopped from using Lipson Street especially the between the Aviation Museum pathway and St Vincent Street. Turn it into a dead end street by closing the road to non police vehicles between the north carpark entrance of NRM and the St Vincent Street.
Secondly install pedestrian crossings on Lipson Street by the Centrelink building and the NRM.
Thirdly the bus stops should be on Baker Street. (Except 252s which should just stop on St Vincent Street)
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 12:56 pm
by omada
Just thought i'd reactivate this thread:
1. To illustrate the folly of our state govt
2. To clarify if this is cancelled once and for all, or I am sure I read somewhere that the Libs Govt was conducting a further study on the viability?
[U/C] Re: Port Adelaide Dock Spur Line
Posted: Mon Feb 24, 2020 1:30 pm
by Honey of a City
omada wrote: ↑Mon Feb 24, 2020 12:56 pm
Just thought i'd reactivate this thread:
1. To illustrate the folly of our state govt
2. To clarify if this is cancelled once and for all, or I am sure I read somewhere that the Libs Govt was conducting a further study on the viability?
Knoll claimed that it's on hold until an overall public transport study is completed. Have seen nothing of this study but that's not to say it's not a reality.
On a track record basis for this government though I'd suggest the project has been killed. Love to be proved wrong.
Meanwhile the local businesses and developments that proceeded on the understanding that this was a go-er are hurting. (It would be operating by now if it had gone ahead).