News & Discussion: National Broadband Network

[rubberman]

Hi amused.

Absolutely no nerves plucked at all.

However, there was the opportunity to set a couple of things straight that are extremely important going forward.

If the Coalition is not forewarned about the system extension issues before it does whatever it does, then it is going to fall neck deep in the doo doo. If it goes ahead, however it wants to go ahead, and it does not have the means for providing those businesses that need it with the speed they require, either they will just go overseas, and that will dent the economy to the detriment of the Coalition, or they will kick up an almighty stink. Either way, the opposition will have a field day. The point I made before about nobody in any utility in the world having a really good handle on it shows how big a potential hole is opening up before the Coalition if they aren't bloody careful. The fact that they made the statement that people could get extensions for about $5k shows that they were not then aware of that great big muddy hole they could be about to step into.

The other thing is about creation of monopolies. The problem with privatising Telstra is that they had the network monopoly. They let it deteriorate to such a point that the government literally has to do something, or the whole lot will corrode away before our very eyes, and soon. That meant that shareholders (and executives) got great dividends and bonuses as the system got worse and worse. Yet, as dire as the system is, we still had to pay for it at a very nice profit. The point of my post about monopolies is to put it to people that if we again give the communications infrastructure to a private monopoly, what is the guarantee that they won't do the same again, and in ten years or so, we again will have to dip into our pockets big time?

[Amused]

Hi amused.

Absolutely no nerves plucked at all.

However, there was the opportunity to set a couple of things straight that are extremely important going forward.

If the Coalition is not forewarned about the system extension issues before it does whatever it does, then it is going to fall neck deep in the doo doo. If it goes ahead, however it wants to go ahead, and it does not have the means for providing those businesses that need it with the speed they require, either they will just go overseas, and that will dent the economy to the detriment of the Coalition, or they will kick up an almighty stink. Either way, the opposition will have a field day. The point I made before about nobody in any utility in the world having a really good handle on it shows how big a potential hole is opening up before the Coalition if they aren't bloody careful. The fact that they made the statement that people could get extensions for about $5k shows that they were not then aware of that great big muddy hole they could be about to step into.

The other thing is about creation of monopolies. The problem with privatising Telstra is that they had the network monopoly. They let it deteriorate to such a point that the government literally has to do something, or the whole lot will corrode away before our very eyes, and soon. That meant that shareholders (and executives) got great dividends and bonuses as the system got worse and worse. Yet, as dire as the system is, we still had to pay for it at a very nice profit. The point of my post about monopolies is to put it to people that if we again give the communications infrastructure to a private monopoly, what is the guarantee that they won't do the same again, and in ten years or so, we again will have to dip into our pockets big time?

I agree with your points. I do. I have three degrees in health, not telecommunications so the logistics of infrastructure roll out are outside of my scope but idealistically, I can see both what is most beneficial technologically, economically and politically, and unfortunately those three things tend to shoot off at equally opposite angles so I appreciate a way forward is not linear.

I completely agree with your second point however. There was all manner of profanities uttered in my household with the notion of Tesltra being brought in to spearhead the Coalition rollout. They did a terrible job by consumers pre NBN and I have no doubt they will do it again post.

[Vee]

Half a million NBN fibre connections in limbo:
Will you miss out on FTTP?
via @ITnews_au

Includes full list for each state.
http://www.itnews.com.au/News/362333,ha ... limbo.aspx?

[drsmith]

Half a million NBN fibre connections in limbo:

In another update today, an additional 150,000 are to get FTTP.

http://www.theage.com.au/it-pro/governm ... hv2bn.html

I found the following part of the above article particularly interesting,

Meanwhile, it has emerged that that NBN Co’s construction contracts were flexible enough for the government to change the type of work done while still keeping its pre-election promise to honour existing commitments. For example, changing the work from fibre-to-home connections to a fibre-to-the-node rollout.

[witsend]

Thank you, Liberal Party!

I am on the Yorke Peninsula, and I am in Telstra Only Territory like almost all of regional australia. Looking forward to my 25Mb FTTN connection on my copper line. Hurry up! I'm sick of weather sensitive connection speeds! At best, I can get an 8Mb connection at best. Fortunatley, I actually have a new line, so I'm might get the 25Mb. So I will continue to pay my Telstra tax via my ISP.

On the other hand, the school I work at will be looking at multiple 13Mb ADSL lines instead of a nice new shiny 400Mb/1000Mb connection. Not bad for 1000 kids, eh?

[rev]

Thank you, Liberal Party!

I am on the Yorke Peninsula, and I am in Telstra Only Territory like almost all of regional australia. Looking forward to my 25Mb FTTN connection on my copper line. Hurry up! I'm sick of weather sensitive connection speeds! At best, I can get an 8Mb connection at best. Fortunatley, I actually have a new line, so I'm might get the 25Mb. So I will continue to pay my Telstra tax via my ISP.

On the other hand, the school I work at will be looking at multiple 13Mb ADSL lines instead of a nice new shiny 400Mb/1000Mb connection. Not bad for 1000 kids, eh?

The school should invest in 13Mb connections for each of it's students and send the monthly bills to their local Liberal candidate.

[rhino]

Thank you, Liberal Party!

I am on the Yorke Peninsula, and I am in Telstra Only Territory like almost all of regional australia. Looking forward to my 25Mb FTTN connection on my copper line. Hurry up! I'm sick of weather sensitive connection speeds! At best, I can get an 8Mb connection at best. Fortunatley, I actually have a new line, so I'm might get the 25Mb. So I will continue to pay my Telstra tax via my ISP.

On the other hand, the school I work at will be looking at multiple 13Mb ADSL lines instead of a nice new shiny 400Mb/1000Mb connection. Not bad for 1000 kids, eh?

Hey Witsend where you been man? 11 post in 4 years????

[Vee]

So much for honouring existing contracts and the "steady flow of work" on the NBN into 2014.
Sad to hear workers being laid off as...

Coalition NBN grinds to a halt.
Australian Financial Review

Construction firms building the national broadband network have told sub-contractors they will have to wait up to five months before receiving more work, as the rollout of fibre optic cabling grinds to a halt.

NBN Co revealed that in October a 10th of its standard workload was carried out. Small work crews physically rolling out fibre cabling along streets and into homes say they will need to cut dozens of staff if there is no further work.

Figures released on Wednesday indicated fewer than 2000 homes and businesses were passed with fibre during October, compared with 28,000 in September.

More:
http://www.afr.com/p/technology/sub_con ... cw56XdnJcJ

[Vee]

To add to previous post ..
I was not on the NBN map for construction in the near future but was always supportive of others being connected. FTTP, fibre all the way, is essential infrastructure for the Digital Era.

How dudded must those coming close to getting connected/on the rollout map feel? Turnbull gave the impression that existing contracts would be honoured, meaning fibre all the way. Now the map has changed and The Age is reporting that...

... NBN contracts are flexible enough to switch from FTTP to FTTN.

http://www.theage.com.au/it-pro/governm ... hv2bn.html
The Age

[claybro]

Vee, you seem to be completely missing the point here. The former governments rollout of FTTH was completely unworkable in the timeline planned, the methods planned and also for the cost planned. Contractors could not conduct the rollout as per their contracts due to personell issues and technical expertise. FTTH OR FTTN the coalition government was elected to go thorugh the former government "gravy trains" with a fine tooth combe. I'm sorry you can not have 16 trillion MBPS or whatever you currently must have, but it is esential this whole mess is sorted out before it even gets started and too many billions more evaporates. If some "feel dudded"... well, welcome to the real world people.

[drsmith]

A CABINET briefing document obtained by The Weekend Australian confirms the Rudd government was aware of significant risks to the National Broadband Network rollout and that delays would strip $1.4 billion in revenues throughout the election campaign.

The document revealed an assessment by consultants KPMG -- who had been engaged by the then Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy Department -- warning that the ramp-up to achieve rollout targets was "presenting a significant risk to the project" and that this "has not been achieved in any international comparison".

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/busines ... 6751590262#

The summary of a cabinet submission by then communications minister Anthony Albanese for the meeting scheduled for July 22 ... [said:] “Given existing delays and the emerging industrial issues, we consider the rollout forecasts are questionable...”

Mr Albanese was pressed during the election campaign on his knowledge of this corporate plan, notably in a debate on ABC’s Lateline program on August 12…

Lateline host Emma Alberici...(:) “Have you got a date for receiving it?”

“We have not received—well, that’s up to the board, but we have not received the final business plan,” said Mr Albanese.

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andr ... n_blowout/

[rubberman]

Claybro,

The main reason for the delays was because of negotiations with Telstra taking much longer than required. In addition, the issue with asbestos in pits was not able to be forseen and had quite a marked effect.

As for the comment about people wanting '16 trillion MBPS or whatever you currently must have' it is just amazing to me to see that people who have no interest in some project or other, immediately see it as useless, and too bad for those who do see the need.

Your comments could similarly be applied to the problems of South Road.

I'm sorry you can not have 16 trillion cars per hour down South Road or whatever you currently must have, but it is esential this whole mess is sorted out before it even gets started and too many billions more evaporates. If some "feel dudded"... well, welcome to the real world people.

Yes, let's stop all projects and spend the next twenty years sorting them out. The first thing we need to sort out is whether or not we all say that our own projects are of national importance and should be funded straight away, and that everyone else's priorities are not worthy of consideration. We'll get a long way that way won't we?

So how about this? This government stops the NBN while it is under way - and in revenge, the next government stops any work on South Road. Whee, the politics of revenge US style coming our way. And make no mistake, stopping the NBN at this stage is nothing but spite.

How immature.

I thought the adults were supposed to be in charge.

[drsmith]

Comment from Telstra regarding NBN rollout delays and asbestos as reported by Fairfax,

A spokeswoman for Telstra said it wasn't to blame for the backlog because it was "well ahead of schedule when the stop work commenced" and has worked constructively with NBN Co to ramp back up and avoid delays.

http://www.theage.com.au/it-pro/governm ... hv2bn.html

Graphic showing rollout progress (third party site),

http://www.mynbn.info/stats

[rubberman]

Well Telstra would say that wouldn't it?

After they were privatised, they royally screwed over the Australian people by letting the copper network get to dire straits.
They then delayed as long as they could in negotiations, so they could get top dollar for this deliberately run down network.
They have therefore put Australian Governments over a barrel where simply to maintain the status quo would require many billions of dollars in repair and replacement of the copper network even if we did not want to go to fibre.
Telstra now wants to put their snout even further in the trough with the new government to make further profit out of the damage they have done to the national communications system and the huge cost to us via upcoming network charges that will be needed to fund either FTTN or FTTH.

If either political parties gives Telstra a look-in, they will deserve all the grief they get. And they will get it.

[drsmith]

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/busines ... 6751590262#

The full article from The Australian above,

A CABINET briefing document obtained by The Weekend Australian confirms the Rudd government was aware of significant risks to the National Broadband Network rollout and that delays would strip $1.4 billion in revenues throughout the election campaign.

The document revealed an assessment by consultants KPMG -- who had been engaged by the then Department of Broadband, Communications and the Digital Economy Department -- warning that the ramp-up to achieve rollout targets was "presenting a significant risk to the project" and that this "has not been achieved in any international comparison".

The summary of a cabinet submission by then communications minister Anthony Albanese for the meeting scheduled for July 22, a fortnight before the election was called, showed a revised corporate plan for the NBN would be considered. The NBN was to figure prominently in the campaign as a signature government policy.

"Given existing delays and the emerging industrial issues, we consider the rollout forecasts are questionable," the summary said. "Further delays will increase funding requirements for the project (existing three month delay cost $1.4 billion in lost revenue)." As well as saying that the planned ramp-up for the NBN had not been achieved in any comparable scheme overseas, the document raised significant questions about project financing.

"KPMG also advised there is a significant risk NBN Co will not be able to raise debt in 2015 without a government guarantee." This was despite the corporate plan assuming $590 million would be raised in that year.

Mr Albanese was pressed during the election campaign on his knowledge of this corporate plan, notably in a debate on ABC's Lateline program on August 12."Anthony is sitting on the latest corporate plan," said then opposition spokesman Malcolm Turnbull. "(He) has not released it to the public.

"Mr Turnbull pressed the then minister. "Well, why don't you produce the latest business plan? It's sitting on your desk. Why don't you produce it? The company gave it to you only a month or so ago."

"That's not right," responded Mr Albanese. "They have not produced the final business plan."

"Oh, I see," said Mr Turnbull. "You've made them keep the draft stamp on it so you don't have to give it out before the election."

"They have not produced the final business plan," replied the minister.

Lateline host Emma Alberici then intervened. "Have you got a date for receiving it?" she asked.

"We have not received -- well, that's up to the board, but we have not received the final business plan," said Mr Albanese.

The cabinet submission summary obtained by The Weekend Australian shows cabinet was to consider a revised plan three weeks earlier.

"We understand Minister Albanese proposes to refer the Corporate Plan back to NBN Co for further work," the document said, "and intends to bring back a revised Plan for Government consideration and release later in the year."

A leaked draft of the plan confirmed the hit to revenues of $1.4bn between 2011 and 2021, and showed the NBN Co expected it would need $1.6bn more funding.