News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

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Brucetiki
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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4261 Post by Brucetiki » Wed Jan 29, 2020 3:33 pm

Norman wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 12:28 pm
Brucetiki wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:03 am
Norman wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 10:28 am
Or they could just leave it as it is. Why try to fix something that is not particularly broken (there are minor issues, but they can be fixed internally without too much of an issue).

If the tram service was in chaos then, sure, outsource operations, but I don't understand what they are trying to fix from the current operations.
The only concern I have with the train network at the moment is the conduct of some of the security guys (which, to be honest, isn't isolated to the train network), and they're getting the boot.

Generally speaking our trains/trams are reliable, mostly on time, and actually in fairly good condition.

I don't think you can say that for Melbourne's privately run trains.
Can you be more specific about the conduct of the security guards? From what I have seen they are generally fine.
Had a few instances at Salisbury where they've refused to accept that public transport is free with your footy ticket.

I now get the train from Parafield as I can't be bothered dealing with them.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4262 Post by ml69 » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:35 pm

SRW wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:09 pm
Labor obtained documents under FOI that show the government is actively considering Grange closure, just as we all suspected.

What a miserly, visionless government.
Let’s face it ... it was inevitable that Grange would have services reduced or be closed.

However it should be replaced by a new West Lakes service. Such a service would be an order of magnitude more patronised than the Grange service. A park and ride car park would make it even more popular.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4263 Post by gnrc_louis » Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:51 pm

ml69 wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 4:35 pm
SRW wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 2:09 pm
Labor obtained documents under FOI that show the government is actively considering Grange closure, just as we all suspected.

What a miserly, visionless government.
Let’s face it ... it was inevitable that Grange would have services reduced or be closed.

However it should be replaced by a new West Lakes service. Such a service would be an order of magnitude more patronised than the Grange service. A park and ride car park would make it even more popular.
Have both. This city has already lost enough rail over the years and they service somewhat different areas anyway I.e. Grange gets a lot of people using the park and ride from Henley etc. Also, if you think this Marshall Government is going to spend millions on a West Lakes extension... then :lol:

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4264 Post by ChillyPhilly » Wed Jan 29, 2020 6:04 pm

Useless government.
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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4265 Post by [Shuz] » Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:26 pm

Look, I'm all for improving public transport but let's be honest, the Grange line barely gets any passengers. I think they would be better off building a rail corridor along West Lakes Boulevard to West Lakes shopping centre and to the new housing development where it will attract higher patronage.
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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4266 Post by gnrc_louis » Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:34 pm

[Shuz] wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 7:26 pm
Look, I'm all for improving public transport but let's be honest, the Grange line barely gets any passengers. I think they would be better off building a rail corridor along West Lakes Boulevard to West Lakes shopping centre and to the new housing development where it will attract higher patronage.
Do you catch it? I catch it daily and frequently on weekends too. At peak times it's busy, while less so at interpeak times, there are still enough users that it warrants being kept open. What should happen is higher density development along the line to encourage greater patronage.

Furthermore, you close Grange and you set a precedent - next goes Belair because it too doesn't get "enough" passengers. Adelaide is a city still heavily reliant on cars - which has a number of drawbacks, removing rail services is going to worsen this reliance and further exacerbate associated issues.

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News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4267 Post by AndyWelsh » Wed Jan 29, 2020 10:29 pm

Well said gnrc_louis

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4268 Post by Eurostar » Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:21 pm

Don't forget also that if motorway is extended via Mile End etc there will be people opting for alternative routes whilst roadworks are occurring and 110 and 130s buses will be delayed so the train will be more attractive

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4269 Post by Spotto » Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:26 pm

I think any serious discussion for the potential rerouting of the Grange Line to West Lakes, if it is at all feasible, should be reserved for when discussions surface over the electrification of the Outer Harbor Line. But in the meantime it should definitely not be closed nor be held to ransom by cutting services to a minimum.

I agree with gnrc_louis's suggestion of encouraging denser development along the corridor. There's a large chunk of currently unoccupied land surrounding Nicholls Terrace which is within walking and cycling distance Albert Park station. Perhaps some kind of incentive (won't happen with this government) to encourage the developer (assuming its owned by a developer?) to emulate Bowden or the residential precinct at Tonsley Village on a smaller scale? That area is approximately half the size of Tonsley Village.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4270 Post by ChillyPhilly » Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:37 pm

Spotto wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:26 pm
I think any serious discussion for the potential rerouting of the Grange Line to West Lakes, if it is at all feasible, should be reserved for when discussions surface over the electrification of the Outer Harbor Line. But in the meantime it should definitely not be closed nor be held to ransom by cutting services to a minimum.

I agree with gnrc_louis's suggestion of encouraging denser development along the corridor. There's a large chunk of currently unoccupied land surrounding Nicholls Terrace which is within walking and cycling distance Albert Park station. Perhaps some kind of incentive (won't happen with this government) to encourage the developer (assuming its owned by a developer?) to emulate Bowden or the residential precinct at Tonsley Village on a smaller scale? That area is approximately half the size of Tonsley Village.
There's also the industrial site and general area around Seaton Park station. It won't happen for a generation, but imagine also if a high density village was built on what is currently the golf course.

I'd be keen to see the Grange line extended south, perhaps as far as West Beach. If that far, then it could double back through the airport and form a transit loop.
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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4271 Post by Norman » Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:21 am

ChillyPhilly wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:37 pm
Spotto wrote:
Wed Jan 29, 2020 11:26 pm
I think any serious discussion for the potential rerouting of the Grange Line to West Lakes, if it is at all feasible, should be reserved for when discussions surface over the electrification of the Outer Harbor Line. But in the meantime it should definitely not be closed nor be held to ransom by cutting services to a minimum.

I agree with gnrc_louis's suggestion of encouraging denser development along the corridor. There's a large chunk of currently unoccupied land surrounding Nicholls Terrace which is within walking and cycling distance Albert Park station. Perhaps some kind of incentive (won't happen with this government) to encourage the developer (assuming its owned by a developer?) to emulate Bowden or the residential precinct at Tonsley Village on a smaller scale? That area is approximately half the size of Tonsley Village.
There's also the industrial site and general area around Seaton Park station. It won't happen for a generation, but imagine also if a high density village was built on what is currently the golf course.

I'd be keen to see the Grange line extended south, perhaps as far as West Beach. If that far, then it could double back through the airport and form a transit loop.
Please no... As much as I have no interest golf, we need this open space in the western suburbs. We don't need to have houses covering every inch of land.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4272 Post by Bob » Thu Jan 30, 2020 10:07 am

As most on here already know, the line has been in the spotlight for some time, and it’s obvious how it’s come to this.

The Grange line was built originally as the Henley Beach line in the 1890’s – a time when ‘seaside holidays’ were in their prime and in high demand for Henley, Semaphore & Glenelg, all connected by rail, as that’s how most people had to travel then. All those lines were also used to transit goods and daily commuting passengers. The only real competition to Henley Beach at that time was the horse drawn tram via a route through ‘the reed beds’ which was a swamp where the River Torrens flowed before water headed either north to Port Reach or south to Patawalonga. The West Beach drainage outlet for the Torrens was not built until approx 1940.

But fast forward to the 1950’s – once the Torrens flooding problem was removed, the western flood plains of Adelaide now become suburbia which allowed for more direct & more often bus routes, electric trams that replaced the horse drawn trams in the 1900’s were on the way out, almost every 1950’s house had a motor car, trucks now carried goods, holiday demand in traditional seaside areas such as Henley & Semaphore drop dramatically because people could drive further afield to the country beaches, then with the Henley line no longer carrying goods and little summer visitors by rail, it gets truncated back to Grange in the late 1950's,becomes a commuter line only, no real end of line destination for large passenger volumes. Then gets truncated a little further later in the piece.

So here we are, as everyone has pointed out, either there needs to be a major population increase planned to 'up' the passenger numbers on the existing line, or go back to one of the original ideas of moving the line to West Lakes, which qualifies more as an 'end of line' destination, than Grange.

Whatever happens, the Government should at least keep the line open, and with proper scheduling until a proper long-term plan is in place.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4273 Post by Honey of a City » Thu Jan 30, 2020 3:31 pm

Why not a light rail from Woodville station using the current rail route to Grange then turning right up Military Road to West Lakes Bvd, then a loop going past the Westlakes shopping centre and new housing developments and rejoining the current rail route at Albert Park.(or vice versa). Would cover and link a large residential and retail catchment plus the beaches. Dual track if necessary. Minimal land acquisition, no loss of current patrons.

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4274 Post by TorrensSA » Thu Jan 30, 2020 3:31 pm

The Grange line has many benefits. There should be three stopping patterns, Grange and Glanville all stops and an Outer Harbor express (Adelaide to Woodville) each would operate at a 30 min frequency therefore a 15 min frequency between Adelaide and Glanville and 30 to Grange and Outer Harbor. It would be nice to see the Gawler line running every 10 min once electrified to say Munno Para than a 20 min frequency to Gawler Central, well there would be one train an hour to Gawler to keep the four trains an hour, all stops - (eg 11.00am MP 11.10 GC 11.20 G 11.30 GC 11.40 MP 11.50GC), if you want to be fair to everyone you would need to up the Seaford line frequency to a train every 10 min and Belair to 20min

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Re: News & Discussion: Adelaide Metro Trains

#4275 Post by Stefan » Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:44 pm

Guys, this is a bit off topic but what do you think about the kiosk opening up at Woodville? It’s been sitting there empty for god knows how long now and I’ve always thought something could do well there, especially during peak hours. Thoughts?

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