The future of rail transport in Adelaide

[Aidan]

As a final year Civil Engineering student at the University of South Australia, my investigation project focuses on the future of rail transport in Adelaide over the next 30 years. The project, which is now in the draft report writing stage, has its own website including a map of the schemes I am investigating, and those rail schemes (plus some road based schemes) which I have considered but chosen not to investigate.

As I am including a link to that in my .sig, I have started this thread for discussing the ideas in it.

[Norman]

Some of those proposals sound familiar

I do like it though, except light rail would be better to run down Marion Road instead of Morphett Road. The number of passengers (and potential number of passengers) is much, much higher on Marion Road.

[jk1237]

One thing I know about your future as an engineering student Aidan, is that you will be earning lots and lots of money when you get work. Wish I studied engineering of some sort

[Somebody]

except light rail would be better to run down Marion Road instead of Morphett Road. The number of passengers (and potential number of passengers) is much, much higher on Marion Road.

Yawners at the endless "light rail" proposals.

Is there actually space for a dedicated reservation at most of these places? If not, what is the point? Run buses in that case.

(And no, don't use the "I dont like buses most ppl lik trams waah i wanna winnie gold " argument)

[Norman]

except light rail would be better to run down Marion Road instead of Morphett Road. The number of passengers (and potential number of passengers) is much, much higher on Marion Road.

Yawners at the endless "light rail" proposals.

Is there actually space for a dedicated reservation at most of these places? If not, what is the point? Run buses in that case.

Trams? Underground?

[Somebody]

You want an underground tramway underneath Marion Rd?

[Norman]

You want an underground tramway underneath Marion Rd?

If funds permit, yes. If not, just run them on-street.

[Shuz]

Norman, ATD, and Aidan,
I'm wondering how do you establish a site like Aidan's where you can plot lines on a Google-based map and upload it onto the internet? I have always been in the midst of compiling my own PT projects (in an ad-hoc manner) but have never got around to compiling a 'comprehensive overview' for viewing and discussion with other forumers.

[Norman]

I use Photoshop and Photoshop only, so I can't help on that front.

[Aidan]

Norman, ATD, and Aidan,
I'm wondering how do you establish a site like Aidan's where you can plot lines on a Google-based map and upload it onto the internet? I have always been in the midst of compiling my own PT projects (in an ad-hoc manner) but have never got around to compiling a 'comprehensive overview' for viewing and discussion with other forumers.

First you need webspace. There are three ways you can get this: from your ISP, a specialist firm, or Google. If you're using Google, you'll need a Gmail account. Once you've got that, go to http://www.googlepages.com to start a site. Don't bother trying to use their page creator, though, as it doesn't do javascript. To write the pages you'll need a javascript compatible html editor. One free one is Seamonkey (which is an updated version of Netscape Communicator). Another is Aptana (which I use, mainly because I wasn't aware of Seamonkey when I first needed its capabilities).

Next you'll need to learn how to write Google maps. A good starting point is http://maps.google.com/support/.

Finally, if you're not using googlepages, you'll probably need an FTP program to upload them.

[Shuz]

Cheers for that. I'm using a web interface via Google Maps which means no private hosting etc. I'm essentially working on just about every vision I've ever had for Adelaide. It will be insanely comprehensive once done, and do expect some surprises.

[Aidan]

Cheers for that. I'm using a web interface via Google Maps which means no private hosting etc. I'm essentially working on just about every vision I've ever had for Adelaide. It will be insanely comprehensive once done, and do expect some surprises.

Private hosting is OK - you just need an API key. And even if it's hosted on Google, it might be worth getting an API key for your ISP anyway, so that you can test things out before you upload them.

[Somebody]

If not, just run them on-street.

Advantage of that over buses is..?

(Please don't use "but trams are nicer !!!!11" as the excuse)

Now to be a tad more specific: street tramways are very slow and not something you would aim for (you need a separate reservation). I know you are all going to come back with "but it workz in maalboourne " - but just take a look at some of their routes, or to be specific the "Outer Swanston" network which would be comparable to Harvey's proposal. Good for locals trips of <5km, hopeless for CBD journeys (better off getting out somewhere that it crosses a railway line and taking a train).

The light rail to Glenelg works as it has it's own reservation from the CBD to Glenelg with stops along it. Could you imagine it as a couple of tram tracks down the middle of a congested two-lane road? I recommend a visit to Sydney Rd in Melbourne - takes the tram 50mins to travel 10km on a typical day.

[Shuz]

I agree with Somebody that some of the on road routes are pointless because they compete with traffic.

In Adelaide's case we should be careful with our network expansion, and should be mindful that trams are to be given priority at all times within their own designated corridor. Our network is incomparable to Melbourne's, but you only need to see that trams are held up incessantly on KWS South and on Jetty Road compromising the effeciency of their service. I personally believe that on both sections, a right-of-way corridor should be implemented as is the case with KWS North and North Terrace, even if that means turning Jetty Road into a shared pedestrian/tram mall, like Bourke Street, Melbourne CBD.

I also have paramount concern for the proposed tram/train operations to be carried out on the Outer Harbor & Grange rail corridor for reasons which I have stated several times before, in summary -compromising efficiency of both networks. It would be a much wiser investment to reinstate tramlines down the Port Road median, where the space is available for a designated corridor like the Glenelg line to maximise our systems efficiency and would attract a larger commuter margin within its urban fabric. Using the previous argument justifies sufficient reason also that trams should straddle the western (northbound) alignment of Port Road as it goes through Thebarton to improve accessibility and provides increased safety.

[Aidan]

except light rail would be better to run down Marion Road instead of Morphett Road. The number of passengers (and potential number of passengers) is much, much higher on Marion Road.

I did consider that, but there are three factors in Morphett Road's favour:

Firstly the route is shorter. Less track will have to be installed, so it would be cheaper. And the depot's presence means that there wouldn't have to be a junction on a level crossing (which could cause safety/complexity problems.

Secondly, a Morphett Road alignment would provide an interchange opportunity at Oaklands station. A Marion Road alignment would not.

Thirdly, Marion Road is busier, so construction would be far more disruptive. And if it were done in conjunction with an underground tollway, the opportunity for express buses would probably prove more attractive than the trams.

Yawners at the endless "light rail" proposals.

If you look at the page you'll see it isn't all light rail, and a big part of my project is comparing the relative merits of light and heavy rail.

Is there actually space for a dedicated reservation at most of these places? If not, what is the point? Run buses in that case.

A dedicated reservation is a big advantage, but it doesn't have to run down the entire route. Obviously we don't want to be stuck in congested traffic, but many of Adelaide's suburban roads aren't congested, even in the peaks. And street running doesn't have to be down the middle of the road - there are some circumstances where gutter running is better.

Trams? Underground?

Underground tunnels are good for express running, but underground stations are very expensive to construct, and have high operating costs because they need to be staffed for safety reasons.