SBD wrote: ↑
Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:43 am
Perhaps Australians who have a life and family somewhere else, but have been in the habit of an annual visit to their parents, relatives and friends here. It's no different than the same issue with state borders.
We're talking about Australians who live in Australia, who have remained overseas after the Prime Minister told all Australians, nearly a year ago, that at that time it was time to return home because their return to Australia later could not be guaranteed.
And as such we have seen a very limited number of flights to return and at a very high cost. They now also have to pay to be quarantined in a hotel, whereas initially it was the tax payer footing the bill.
Baxter and similar were designed to support community, and do not generally have the facilities to allow the returned travellers to remain separated from each other.
What, how would they remain separated from each other? A family returns from overseas, and you quarantine them together in the same facility. The same way they are quarantined together in a hotel.
A facility that can contain 15,000 quarantined people, plus the people needed to provide security, medical, food, garbage collection, etc, an international airport and its staff, and if we don't want the staff rotating back to the cities on their weekends, then it also has to provide for their families, including school etc. That sounds like a city.
Again, let me say..WHAT??!!!
15,000 people? We have a detention centre that can accommodate 15,000 people?
Why would you nee to provide for their families, schools? WTF?
You're just making up a bunch of assumptions, to use in your argument against.
None of it makes sense, none of it is logical.
FIFO workers do not get anything of the sort provided for them of the like of which you're suggesting for detention centre quarantine.
Instead they are well compensated financially, which is why a lot of people take up those jobs in mines as FIFO workers. Because a few years of sacrifice can have long term benefits for those individuals and/or their families.
Rotations on weekends? WTF, again, just another wild assumption you're making.
I haven't posted some detailed outline or schedule of workers to/from. I've made a simple suggestion that would take the risk of an outbreak OUT of our major population centres. You know those major population centres, like the one you presumably live in, that are the heart of our nation and our economies. The same places that keep taking a beating every time there's an outbreak caused by a hotel breach, which in turn batters the economy.
We have multiple centres around the country, and in our offshore territories (ie Christmas Island), that can well accommodate those in quarantine at the moment. We have disused military facilities, we have disused mining camps.
There are many solutions that are far better then quarantining people with a so called highly contagious virus or it's even more highly contagious strains in the middle of our main major urban population centres.
Let's break it down as simply as possible...
Highly contagious virus, which has now mutated into several even more contagious strains (and apparently in the UK two mutant strains have mutated together.....)
Option 1 - quarantine the returned or sick in the middle of our major urban centres, and continue to do so after several breaches.
Option 2 - get the detention centres up and running again to house these people for their quarantine period, look at other sites that would be suitable (ie military bases and mine sites) that would help cope with a major outbreak. Leave it in the hands of the ADF on conjunction with working with health and government officials.
Option 1 results continually in lock downs of major population centres, and entire states, state borders get routinely closed, economic activity takes massive hits, and other flow on effects such as mental health issues.
Option 2 allows life to go on as close to normal as possible under the global circumstances for the majority of Australians, we can avoid the continued lock down/state border closure cycle because we wont have hotel quarantine breaches to contend with any more.
This is partly why we have a defence force, to assist in time of need and a national crisis. We are in that time right now.
gee I wonder which option is better...
Governments have already spent hundreds of millions on this rubbish hotel quarantine system, money that could have been better spent on Option 2.
We/they are learning more about what is needed and how to manage the quarantine. While there is lots of virus in the community, a small leak from quarantine can't be detected. We are now in the position where we can see every little leak and work to patch it before it happens again.
Clearly you haven't learned much, if you still think quarantining the sick in hotels located in the middle of our major urban centres where the majority of our population lives is the best solution.
If there was lots of virus in the community, we would be seeing "community transmission" on a daily basis. We aren't.
The risk posed at present is from returned travellers. That's why they are being quarantined, not you.
Yeh, we're sure at the point where we can "see every little leak and work to patch it before it happens again", that's why WA went into lock down the other week, that's why Victoria is in lock down this week. And that's why in the coming months it will keep happening over and over again.
They do have other jobs too. Are you happy to let them slide, or would you recruit a larger army to fill this extra role? Reservists also have "day jobs" so you would hurt the economy to call them up to full time service.
There are currently roughly 28,000~ reservists in the ADF.
If all 28,000 were called up (they wouldn't, but for arguments sake with your level lets say they were), and mind you the reserves are paid when they're called up, that's a very very tiny hit to the economy compared to having the entire state of Victoria, or 6.7 million people, not at work.
Go on, argue with me how locking down entire states and continually hitting the economy with a wrecking ball is a better idea.
You were the one who mentioned the economy. International students contribute to our economy. They enable universities to offer more courses for everyone.
Yeh, that's how you think it works is it? You think with international students taking up places their parents have paid up front for, that the unis magically then have more places to offer to Australian kids? Wow..
No SBD, with international students paying fees up front, there are fewer places for Australian kids.
How do we know this? Very simply because without the paid up front foreign students from India and China this year, we have a record number of Australian kids taking up places at our universities.
International students is nothing but a cash grab opportunity for universities.
We'd also benefit by not having ugly as pig shit student towers going up on our skylines. I'd rather decades of no change to the skyline then the monstrosities that have gone up to house foreign students.
So do tourists. Clearly we need the international cruise ship industry to start calling on Australia again, not just the local ship that is in SA waters at present.
We spend $38 billion on overseas holidays. Of course it's far less then the $120 billion from international arrivals here, but that's where governments can step in and assist like our state government has with travel vouchers.
But that $38 billion is better spent here in Australia on intra and interstate tourism.
This could also be taken as an opportunity to develop our domestic tourism industry across the country. And you may or may not know, the local cruise ship tourism sector was growing before this pandemic.
See, this is another reason why we need a better solution like using detention centres rather then hotel quarantine which continually sees state borders closed and states and cities plunged into lockdowns.