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Re: SA State Election 2022
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 4:35 pm
by Nort
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:34 pm
[Shuz] wrote: ↑Sat Apr 02, 2022 11:29 am
As far as I can read into the situation, ACC will not do anything about Currie or Grenfell Streets without a matching, or higher funding contribution from the State Government given that it is the busiest bus corridor in Adelaide. agree with this stance, the buses (and commuters to a lesser degree) have caused so much wear and tear on the roads, DIT should at least take some responsibility to improve the streetscape.
Good case in example, North Terrace and King William Street - ACC took care of the streetscape and footpaths, DIT took care of the road and utilities when building the tram lines.
We urgently need a bus tunnel under Currie/Grenfell Streets and connect it to the O-Bahn tunnel. It's shame no one in politics talks about it.
Why a bus tunnel? While many bus routes go through the city, they do so because it's the main start/end point for peoples bus journeys. So a tunnel isn't enough, you'd need stations along much of the length of the tunnel along with pedestrian access to the surface. A truly staggering cost for...what exactly? Buses already have dedicated lanes for busy times, so they don't spend much time waiting in traffic on Currie/Grenfell Streets. If we need even more buses moving along that corridor or want to reduce surface traffic then the much better solution is to decrease car movement along those roads.
Re: SA State Election 2022
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:26 pm
by 1NEEDS2POST
Nort wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 4:35 pm
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:34 pm
[Shuz] wrote: ↑Sat Apr 02, 2022 11:29 am
As far as I can read into the situation, ACC will not do anything about Currie or Grenfell Streets without a matching, or higher funding contribution from the State Government given that it is the busiest bus corridor in Adelaide. agree with this stance, the buses (and commuters to a lesser degree) have caused so much wear and tear on the roads, DIT should at least take some responsibility to improve the streetscape.
Good case in example, North Terrace and King William Street - ACC took care of the streetscape and footpaths, DIT took care of the road and utilities when building the tram lines.
We urgently need a bus tunnel under Currie/Grenfell Streets and connect it to the O-Bahn tunnel. It's shame no one in politics talks about it.
Why a bus tunnel? While many bus routes go through the city, they do so because it's the main start/end point for peoples bus journeys. So a tunnel isn't enough, you'd need stations along much of the length of the tunnel along with pedestrian access to the surface. A truly staggering cost for...what exactly? Buses already have dedicated lanes for busy times, so they don't spend much time waiting in traffic on Currie/Grenfell Streets. If we need even more buses moving along that corridor or want to reduce surface traffic then the much better solution is to decrease car movement along those roads.
Yes, put the bus stops underground too. This is what happens in Brisbane's CBD. There are many traffic lights between East and West Terrace that a bus tunnel would bypass, which bus lanes can't help with. A tunnel portal near West Terrace, one near East Terrace and a connection to the O-Bahn tunnel would not cost too much.
The O-Bahn tunnel cost $160 million. An East to West Terrace bus tunnel would be twice as long and twice as wide (since four lanes are needed at bus stops to allow buses to pass). It could be built using cut and cover since it's just a straight tunnel under the road. Even if it cost four times the O-Bahn tunnel, it would be worth it since most bus routes in Adelaide use these streets.
The footpaths on Currie and Grenfell Streets could be widened and the current O-Bahn tunnel portal on the city end could be returned to parkland.
Re: SA State Election 2022
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:29 pm
by gnrc_louis
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:26 pm
Nort wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 4:35 pm
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:34 pm
We urgently need a bus tunnel under Currie/Grenfell Streets and connect it to the O-Bahn tunnel. It's shame no one in politics talks about it.
Why a bus tunnel? While many bus routes go through the city, they do so because it's the main start/end point for peoples bus journeys. So a tunnel isn't enough, you'd need stations along much of the length of the tunnel along with pedestrian access to the surface. A truly staggering cost for...what exactly? Buses already have dedicated lanes for busy times, so they don't spend much time waiting in traffic on Currie/Grenfell Streets. If we need even more buses moving along that corridor or want to reduce surface traffic then the much better solution is to decrease car movement along those roads.
Yes, put the bus stops underground too. This is what happens in Brisbane's CBD. There are many traffic lights between East and West Terrace that a bus tunnel would bypass, which bus lanes can't help with. A tunnel portal near West Terrace, one near East Terrace and a connection to the O-Bahn tunnel would not cost too much.
The O-Bahn tunnel cost $160 million. An East to West Terrace bus tunnel would be twice as long and twice as wide (since four lanes are needed at bus stops to allow buses to pass). It could be built using cut and cover since it's just a straight tunnel under the road. Even if it cost four times the O-Bahn tunnel, it would be worth it since most bus routes in Adelaide use these streets.
The footpaths on Currie and Grenfell Streets could be widened and the current O-Bahn tunnel portal on the city end could be returned to parkland.
I think that money would be better spent toward an underground city train loop.
Re: SA State Election 2022
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 6:20 pm
by 1NEEDS2POST
gnrc_louis wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:29 pm
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:26 pm
Nort wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 4:35 pm
Why a bus tunnel? While many bus routes go through the city, they do so because it's the main start/end point for peoples bus journeys. So a tunnel isn't enough, you'd need stations along much of the length of the tunnel along with pedestrian access to the surface. A truly staggering cost for...what exactly? Buses already have dedicated lanes for busy times, so they don't spend much time waiting in traffic on Currie/Grenfell Streets. If we need even more buses moving along that corridor or want to reduce surface traffic then the much better solution is to decrease car movement along those roads.
Yes, put the bus stops underground too. This is what happens in Brisbane's CBD. There are many traffic lights between East and West Terrace that a bus tunnel would bypass, which bus lanes can't help with. A tunnel portal near West Terrace, one near East Terrace and a connection to the O-Bahn tunnel would not cost too much.
The O-Bahn tunnel cost $160 million. An East to West Terrace bus tunnel would be twice as long and twice as wide (since four lanes are needed at bus stops to allow buses to pass). It could be built using cut and cover since it's just a straight tunnel under the road. Even if it cost four times the O-Bahn tunnel, it would be worth it since most bus routes in Adelaide use these streets.
The footpaths on Currie and Grenfell Streets could be widened and the current O-Bahn tunnel portal on the city end could be returned to parkland.
I think that money would be better spent toward an underground city train loop.
I'd like to see both, but a rail tunnel could not be cut and cover under the city because it would have to turn corners. It would also be longer, so it would be much more expensive. There's also the fact that more than three times as many people travel by bus:
Re: SA State Election 2022
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 6:46 pm
by Nort
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:26 pm
Nort wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 4:35 pm
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:34 pm
We urgently need a bus tunnel under Currie/Grenfell Streets and connect it to the O-Bahn tunnel. It's shame no one in politics talks about it.
Why a bus tunnel? While many bus routes go through the city, they do so because it's the main start/end point for peoples bus journeys. So a tunnel isn't enough, you'd need stations along much of the length of the tunnel along with pedestrian access to the surface. A truly staggering cost for...what exactly? Buses already have dedicated lanes for busy times, so they don't spend much time waiting in traffic on Currie/Grenfell Streets. If we need even more buses moving along that corridor or want to reduce surface traffic then the much better solution is to decrease car movement along those roads.
Yes, put the bus stops underground too. This is what happens in Brisbane's CBD. There are many traffic lights between East and West Terrace that a bus tunnel would bypass, which bus lanes can't help with. A tunnel portal near West Terrace, one near East Terrace and a connection to the O-Bahn tunnel would not cost too much.
The O-Bahn tunnel cost $160 million. An East to West Terrace bus tunnel would be twice as long and twice as wide (since four lanes are needed at bus stops to allow buses to pass). It could be built using cut and cover since it's just a straight tunnel under the road. Even if it cost four times the O-Bahn tunnel, it would be worth it since most bus routes in Adelaide use these streets.
The footpaths on Currie and Grenfell Streets could be widened and the current O-Bahn tunnel portal on the city end could be returned to parkland.
Nothing is impossible with enough money but there's no way it would only be four times the cost of the existing tunnel. Add in surface connections, moving all the underground infrastructure, and rebuilding the surface roads and you probably won't get it done for much less than a billion. Does it add more value than a billion spent elsewhere in the PT system would?
Re: SA State Election 2022
Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2022 10:54 pm
by SRW
Nort wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 6:46 pm
1NEEDS2POST wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 5:26 pm
Nort wrote: ↑Mon Apr 25, 2022 4:35 pm
Why a bus tunnel? While many bus routes go through the city, they do so because it's the main start/end point for peoples bus journeys. So a tunnel isn't enough, you'd need stations along much of the length of the tunnel along with pedestrian access to the surface. A truly staggering cost for...what exactly? Buses already have dedicated lanes for busy times, so they don't spend much time waiting in traffic on Currie/Grenfell Streets. If we need even more buses moving along that corridor or want to reduce surface traffic then the much better solution is to decrease car movement along those roads.
Yes, put the bus stops underground too. This is what happens in Brisbane's CBD. There are many traffic lights between East and West Terrace that a bus tunnel would bypass, which bus lanes can't help with. A tunnel portal near West Terrace, one near East Terrace and a connection to the O-Bahn tunnel would not cost too much.
The O-Bahn tunnel cost $160 million. An East to West Terrace bus tunnel would be twice as long and twice as wide (since four lanes are needed at bus stops to allow buses to pass). It could be built using cut and cover since it's just a straight tunnel under the road. Even if it cost four times the O-Bahn tunnel, it would be worth it since most bus routes in Adelaide use these streets.
The footpaths on Currie and Grenfell Streets could be widened and the current O-Bahn tunnel portal on the city end could be returned to parkland.
Nothing is impossible with enough money but there's no way it would only be four times the cost of the existing tunnel. Add in surface connections, moving all the underground infrastructure, and rebuilding the surface roads and you probably won't get it done for much less than a billion. Does it add more value than a billion spent elsewhere in the PT system would?
I believe the Adelaide St section of Brisbane Metro is costing $1.2 billion and that's only a few hundred metres. Tunnelling Grenfell/Currie, even if cut/cover, will be more. We need those billions for an underground rail link given that will be a far more transformative investment.