[COM] Southern Expressway Duplication | $445m | 22km

[[Shuz]]

Just to clarify;

There will be 3 northbound and 3 southbound lanes between Old Noarlunga and Reynella interchanges, and then 4 northbound and 3 south bound lanes between Reynella and Darlington interchanges?

[Archer]

Just to clarify;

There will be 3 northbound and 3 southbound lanes between Old Noarlunga and Reynella interchanges, and then 4 northbound and 3 south bound lanes between Reynella and Darlington interchanges?

No, According to the Project Impact Report Supplement which was recently released, this would indicate that the section between Old Noarlunga and Reynella Interchange will remain as 2 lanes south bound with an additional 2 lanes for north bound traffic being constructed with the duplication. For the Section between Reynella and Marion, you are correct, 4 north bound lanes and 3 south bound lanes.

See documents here: http://dpti.sa.gov.au/southern_expressw ... blications

[HeapsGood]

When exiting the Northbound Marion exit, can I turn right to go towards Flagstaff Rd, or can I only turn left onto Marion? Im guessing not.

EDIT, http://210.247.132.180/alt-host/assets/ ... design.pdf, page 6 = yes, you can.

Page 7...you still cant exit southbound at the Reynella junction and turn a simple left onto South road...epic fail.

[Jim Boukas]

The upgrade of the southern expressway is a waste of valuable tax payers money!!!

Induced demmand people, if the road is made more user friendly, then everyone will want to use it and of course it will reach capacity and require more lanes to be built, when will this madness end???

This government should look at taking one lane away from all the main roads in Adelaide and making them dedicated bus lanes, this will mean that we will be forced to get out of our cars and start using public transport. I vote we stop spending money on encouraging commuters to use their vehicles but instead get them onto public transport a much more cost effective solution.

It should also decrease any carbon tax Burdon to the average motorist.

[[Shuz]]

The village idiot is back!

Fortunately, I relegate this latest squabble to page thirty seven news.

[rhino]

He's been struggling with an identity crisis for the last few months.

I think he might be his own nemesis.

[skyliner]

Interesting to see that he seems against almost all development - and does not appear that informed while doing so either.

ADELAIDE - TOWARDS A GREATER CITY SKYLINE

[baytram366]

Just to add my to this topic - bring it on! Its been way overdue and should have been built correctly in the first place. Looking forward to seeing this project done and dusted once and for all.

[ynotsfables]

The upgrade of the southern expressway is a waste of valuable tax payers money!!!

Induced demmand people, if the road is made more user friendly, then everyone will want to use it and of course it will reach capacity and require more lanes to be built, when will this madness end???

This government should look at taking one lane away from all the main roads in Adelaide and making them dedicated bus lanes, this will mean that we will be forced to get out of our cars and start using public transport. I vote we stop spending money on encouraging commuters to use their vehicles but instead get them onto public transport a much more cost effective solution.

It should also decrease any carbon tax Burdon to the average motorist.

Seriously dude its a bit early for the comedy festival.

[Jim Boukas]

Seriously dude its a bit early for the comedy festival.

It's funny you should say that because when I first joined this site a few years ago I wanted (like many Adelaideians) for a Nth/Sth freeway to be built and I got shot down in flames and had induced demand forced down my throat!!! Now it seems some of these so called advocates for induced demand are supporting the duplication of the southern express way and the super way. What I find confusing is why does induced demand not apply to these two projects but applies to the section of south road between Darlington and Regency Park???

Can someone please explain that to me?????

I pray for the day when I can drive my 60’s muscle car (burning fossil fuel at 30L/100kms) from McLaren Vale to Gawler non stop oh what a utopia that will be!!!! But alas I doubt my grandchildren will see that let alone me!!!!

[rhino]

I pray for the day when I can drive my 60’s muscle car (burning fossil fuel at 30L/100kms) from McLaren Vale to Gawler non stop oh what a utopia that will be!!!! But alas I doubt my grandchildren will see that let alone me!!!!

Camaro? Is that you?

[spiller]

in for the details on the Camaro Jim Bourkas, we have one in our family.

taking it back on-topic, which end are they starting from? Or will it be happening at both ends and meeting somewhere in the middle?

[monotonehell]

Camaro? Is that you?

This was established ages ago.

Jim, the thing with induced demand is that you need to recognise that it is real and factor that into what you are proposing.

Where there's a lot of parallel roads of a reasonable standard, all going in the general direction that people want to go, then you find that people will distribute themselves roughly equally amongst those roads. If you then decide to build a freeway along that same general alignment (as was the case in many US cities post-1950s, and wasn't at the time a response to congestion, but for a desire to improve travel times) then you induce demand from those surface roads to the freeway. There's also an additional increase in use as people are attracted to the new route. After a while capacity is reached and exceeded.

What should happen in these cases is the grid work of surface roads be maintained, and public transport options looked at for the high patronage routes. In most cases where there's a good coverage of surface roads, capacity can be satisfied.


If on the other hand you have a situation like we have in the south, and to a lesser degree in the NE suburbs, where a lot of residences are located occupied by a lot of commuters. And the situation is compounded by the slim route available, then a freeway is possibly a solution to be investigated. As well as a complimenting public transport solution for the high patronage routes.

Induced demand isn't something that applies equally to all situations, it's isn't something that says outright "no" to all freeways being built. It is something, however, that can be demonstrated, and we have a long history of other cities to look at to see what does and does not work. It's a matter of looking a few steps ahead, instead of what just seems to satisfy the current solution.

There's a song about it...

[Jim Boukas]

Who is this camaro everyone seems to be talking about he/she seems a very insightful person, hopefully I can meet him/her sometime.

Monotone Hell, thank you for that detailed explanation of how ID does not apply in all cases especially in the south due to the limited amount of roads heading in the same direction, I mean I can really only think of 5 (Lonsdale Freeway, Southern Expressway, South Road, Flagstaff hill road and Sheppard’s Hill Road). Conversely the roads heading nth from Darlington onwards total to 4 (Goodwood Road, South Road, Marion Road and Tappley’s Hill Road). That does make sense to me now the less roads in the south (5) justify the need to double the southern express way and also mean that ID does not really apply in this situation, but the section between Darlington and Regency Park has many more main roads (4), therefore ID demand does apply here.

My god I have failed to see the trees from the forest, thank you once again for opening my eyes!!!.

[[Shuz]]

There is no such thing as the Lonsdale Freeway.